get me out of this mess

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by Rich Fronheiser

I can't say I've done this in years. It's a varsity game -- if they don't know not to reach across, I can't help them at this point in their basketball lives.

I don't do it if I think there's any chance they should know better. There are varsity players who probably shouldn't be at that level, but find themselves in over their heads for whatever reason. I don't see any point in sticking it to them for something they've never been told, especially when it's so easy to "preventive officiate".

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

I don't do it if I think there's any chance they should know better. There are varsity players who probably shouldn't be at that level, but find themselves in over their heads for whatever reason. I don't see any point in sticking it to them for something they've never been told, especially when it's so easy to "preventive officiate".

Preventatively officiate?

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by mplagrow

Preventatively officiate?

Okay, it's official. We've found our new Mr. Annoying Grammar Guy. Congratulations, MP. PS, we'll probably need to know your real name, at least for the purposes of cussing you out when you get too annoying.

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by rainmaker

Okay, it's official. We've found our new Mr. Annoying Grammar Guy. Congratulations, MP. PS, we'll probably need to know your real name, at least for the purposes of cussing you out when you get too annoying.

Hey, check out my post on the great game winning shot if you think THAT was anal! Oh, and it's Marty. Former teacher. Yes, I did teach English.

[rainmaker]

Originally Posted by mplagrow

Hey, check out my post on the great game winning shot if you think THAT was anal! Oh, and it's Marty. Former teacher. Yes, I did teach English.

Way cool!! An English teacher!! I saw it. And the one in the thread about the Boise-ball partner. But this thread was the final straw. Now that you've been selected, and your scepter is firmly grasped, I'll just suggest that you don't necessarily correct every single error on this board. You'll just wear yourself out. Remember, "Cast not your pearls before .... " Well, remember that one, but I suppose it's probably not smart to say it here, eh? Let's see...

okay how about if I invoke in you Noblesse Oblige? "the moral obligation of those of high birth, powerful social position, etc., to act with honor, kindliness, generosity, etc." I'd put "the benefit of the doubt" into that list.

[mplagrow]

OK, if rudeness is the weak person's imitation of strength, then what the h-e-double toothpicks is sarcasm?

I'd like to thank the academy, and all the little people I stepped on to get where I am today. . .

Oh, and btw, I figure correcting errors is the best way to get my posting numbers up!

[Hartsy]

Originally Posted by mplagrow

Preventatively officiate?

What's wrong with preventive, Mr. Annoying Grammar Guy? I'm more annoyed by prevent-A-tive.

Oh, yeah. About the basketball part. Sounds like an easy T to me, even if you hadn't said anything before the throw in.

[Ignats75]

I've never understood the attitude that I see here sometimes about, "they should know the rules. I don't need to remind them." What's wrong with telling a defender "don't break the plane"? These are high school kids for gosh sakes. My own teenage kids have a hard time remembering what they are supposed to do in non-stressful situations let alone in a tie basketball game with a few sconds left. What does a quick reminder hurt?

To me, that type of attitude strikes me as "I can't be bothered" or laziness. At the very least (cue James Earl Jones) "I AM REF-MAN. HEAR ME ROAR."

The best refereed games we do are the ones where we aren't noticed. It goes without saying that if I have to make a call in that situation, I am going to be noticed. If I can prevent the violation (or even better, T) and let the kids settle it with their own lack of athleticism, that, by the aforementioned definition is a job well done.

[Jimgolf]

IMO, you have no business advising the player not to reach thorugh the plane in the last second, unless you've been doing this the whole game.

[Ignats75]

So what are you saying? Preventative refereeing shouldn't be used? So instead of telling a kid not to reach through, before the play starts, I should wait for the violation and blow my whistle, for a warning (or worse a T if they've already been warned), thus getting involved in the outcome of the game, instead of letting the kids settle it? I may get flamed here, but I'll always try to use preventative refereeing when possible.

I stand by this statement from yesterday:

The best refereed games we do are the ones where we aren't noticed. It goes without saying that if I have to make a call in that situation, I am going to be noticed. If I can prevent the violation (or even better, T) and let the kids settle it with their own lack of athleticism, that, by the aforementioned definition is a job well done.

[mick]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

So what are you saying? Preventative refereeing shouldn't be used? So instead of telling a kid not to reach through, before the play starts, I should wait for the violation and blow my whistle, for a warning (or worse a T if they've already been warned), thus getting involved in the outcome of the game, instead of letting the kids settle it? I may get flamed here, but I'll always try to use preventative refereeing when possible.

Well, for me, if I wanted to coach, I would have taken up coaching.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

I should wait for the violation and blow my whistle, for a warning (or worse a T if they've already been warned), thus getting involved in the outcome of the game, instead of letting the kids settle it?

Just something to think about - if the kid reaches through, thus prompting the violation, isn't the kid helping to decide the outcome? If the kid starts to reach through, and you tell them not to, and they stop, aren't you then being involved in the outcome, rather than the kids? Aren't you depriving the other team of the benefit of getting the ball back due to the player's violation? If the coach tells the kid to get the delay warning, and you tell them not to before handing the ball to the thrower, aren't you then injecting yourself into the game?

Preventative officiating is a good concept, but we have to be careful when it's used. Otherwise, we would be doing exactly what we're trying to prevent - putting ourselves into the situation instead of letting the kids decide the outcome. The player commits the violation; we just make the call.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Ignats75

I've never understood the attitude that I see here sometimes about, "they should know the rules. I don't need to remind them." What's wrong with telling a defender "don't break the plane"? These are high school kids for gosh sakes. My own teenage kids have a hard time remembering what they are supposed to do in non-stressful situations let alone in a tie basketball game with a few sconds left. What does a quick reminder hurt?

Should I remind them not to intentionally foul? Travel?

Originally Posted by Ignats75

To me, that type of attitude strikes me as "I can't be bothered" or laziness. At the very least (cue James Earl Jones) "I AM REF-MAN. HEAR ME ROAR."

Because you disagree with someone makes them lazy? GMAFB.

Originally Posted by Ignats75

The best refereed games we do are the ones where we aren't noticed. It goes without saying that if I have to make a call in that situation, I am going to be noticed. If I can prevent the violation (or even better, T) and let the kids settle it with their own lack of athleticism, that, by the aforementioned definition is a job well done.

Talk about fallacies. I prefer a quote from Major League umpire Bruce Froemming:

"One of the really wrong theories about officiating is that a good official is one you never notice. The umpire who made that statement was probably a real poor official who tried to get his paycheck and hide behind his partners and stay out of trouble all his life."

[mplagrow]

Originally Posted by Hartsy

What's wrong with preventive, Mr. Annoying Grammar Guy? I'm more annoyed by prevent-A-tive.

Oh, yeah. About the basketball part. Sounds like an easy T to me, even if you hadn't said anything before the throw in.

She used it as an adverb. Preventive is an adjective.

[blindzebra]

Originally Posted by mplagrow

Preventatively officiate?

Preventively officiate?