Team Control

[buckrog64]

I have read the rule and case book over and over on this, but I swear I see the team control/free throw shooting still being mishandled in game situations. There are only a few times when team control does not exist. Otherwise, a foul, when team control exists, does not result in free throws, regardless of the bonus situation, etc. Generally I trust my knowledge on this until I see someone else in action and they're granting free throws when I don't believe they should.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by buckrog64

Otherwise, a foul, when team control exists, does not result in free throws, regardless of the bonus situation, etc.

This is only true when the team with team control fouls. A defensive foul would result in free throws during the bonus...

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by jdw3018

This is only true when the team with team control fouls. A defensive foul would result in free throws during the bonus...

Absoltely correct. It applies to common fouls committed by players (without the ball) of the team with team control. The apparent intent is treat these fouls the same as a player control foul - no free throws in penalty situations. The number of these fouls aren't typically that significant percentage wise - they consist mostly of either illegal screens, or a post player pushing or holding while trying to get better position.

[truerookie]

I understand where buckrog64 is coming from. I go out occassionaly and observe the more experienced officials.(Those that get assigned post season play). I often observe them "kicking this rule" .

[Junker]

Can you give specific examples? Without a specific play it's difficult to judge whether they're kicking the call or not.

[truerookie]

Originally Posted by Junker

Can you give specific examples? Without a specific play it's difficult to judge whether they're kicking the call or not.

Sure,
A 33 drives down the lane passes ball to A 44 momentum cause him/her to charge into B 24 who has LGP. There is no longer player control thus resulting in team control.

[Junker]

Originally Posted by truerookie

Sure,
A 33 drives down the lane passes ball to A 44 momentum cause him/her to charge into B 24 who has LGP. There is no longer player control thus resulting in team control.

4-12-2 A team is in control of the ball when a player of the team is in control, while a live ball is being passed between teammates and during an interrupted dribble.

In your post, there is still team control.

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by Junker

4-12-2 A team is in control of the ball when a player of the team is in control, while a live ball is being passed between teammates and during an interrupted dribble.

In your post, there is still team control.

I think that's what he's saying. There's no longer player control, so it's not a PC foul. But there is still TC, which makes this a TC foul.

[Junker]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

I think that's what he's saying. There's no longer player control, so it's not a PC foul. But there is still TC, which makes this a TC foul.

Could be. I wasn't sure so I posted the rule. Whether or it's team control or player control, the way the penalty is administered doesn't change though. The OP was about awarding free throws. No free throws for either.

[buckrog64]

The example I saw was a call away from the ball on the team in control (A). Ball is simply being passed around and the call is made. The next thing I know, they're looking at the scoreboard, see seven team fouls, so they march to the other end of the court for bonus. It was 9th grade game, no one knows diddly, but I sit there watching and wondering what I'm missing about that rule. Maybe it happened during a rebound, and then as I understand it, you would have free throw(s), unless of course I have that incorrect as well.

[buckrog64]

JDW: Point taken from your earlier post. I clearly understand the fouls and situations that occur with the defense in relation to team control. The basis of my question was primarily 'offense minded' and just making sure it's being handled properly. I promise you, few coaches, and fewer fans have any idea how this rule works.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by buckrog64

The example I saw was a call away from the ball on the team in control (A). Ball is simply being passed around and the call is made. The next thing I know, they're looking at the scoreboard, see seven team fouls, so they march to the other end of the court for bonus. It was 9th grade game, no one knows diddly, but I sit there watching and wondering what I'm missing about that rule. Maybe it happened during a rebound, and then as I understand it, you would have free throw(s), unless of course I have that incorrect as well.

During a rebound there is no team control, as team control ends on a try. Therefore you are correct and it would not be a team control foul and free throws would be administered.

[jdw3018]

Originally Posted by buckrog64

JDW: Point taken from your earlier post. I clearly understand the fouls and situations that occur with the defense in relation to team control. The basis of my question was primarily 'offense minded' and just making sure it's being handled properly. I promise you, few coaches, and fewer fans have any idea how this rule works.

I'm with you - just making sure everyone is on the same page. You're right - team control is still new enough that many fans and a few coaches still don't get it.