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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 01:50am
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player control/team control

Whats the difference between player control and team control?
please e-mail me at [email protected] or answer to this topic.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 01:59am
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Player control foul is when the player with the ball commits a foul.

Team control foul is when a team member who happens to be in control (by rule in NF rules) commits a foul.

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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 02:09am
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thanks for that fast response.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 11:40am
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Just to be very clear.

A player control foul is a foul committed by the person who has player control. A team control is committed by a member of the team in control, but that player doesn't have player control.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 11:55am
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Also, in HS (and NCAA-W, I think), a player control foul can be called if the player has released the ball on a shot, even though the player is no longer holding the ball.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:01pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rainmaker
Just to be very clear.

A player control foul is a foul committed by the person who has player control. A team control is committed by a member of the team in control, but that player doesn't have player control.
Where does it say that?

IOW...a player ctl foul is a team ctl foul.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:01pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckElias
Also, in HS (and NCAA-W, I think), a player control foul can be called if the player has released the ball on a shot, even though the player is no longer holding the ball.
This is correct (W-NCAA), if the player has released the ball and has yet to return to the floor and then charges into a defender it is a player/team control foul.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:06pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan_ref
Where does it say that?

IOW...a player ctl foul is a team ctl foul.
Basketball
NFHS
Casebook
Rule 4
4.23.2 Guarding Position


SITUATION: B1 jumps in front of dribbler A1 and obtains a legal guarding position with both feet touching the court and facing A1. Dribbler A1 contacts B1's torso.
RULING: Player control foul on A1. (4-7-2)

Basketball
NFHS
Casebook
Rule 4
4.12.1-B Player and / or Team Control


*SITUATION: A1 is dribbling in A's backcourt when the ball accidentally strikes his / her ankle and bounces away. During the interrupted dribble, A1 fouls B1 in attempting to continue the dribble.
RULING: A team-control foul is charged to A1. It is not a player control foul as the contact occurred during an interrupted dribble. (4-19-7)
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:13pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonRef
Basketball
NFHS
Casebook
Rule 4
4.23.2 Guarding Position


SITUATION: B1 jumps in front of dribbler A1 and obtains a legal guarding position with both feet touching the court and facing A1. Dribbler A1 contacts B1's torso.
RULING: Player control foul on A1. (4-7-2)

Basketball
NFHS
Casebook
Rule 4
4.12.1-B Player and / or Team Control


*SITUATION: A1 is dribbling in A's backcourt when the ball accidentally strikes his / her ankle and bounces away. During the interrupted dribble, A1 fouls B1 in attempting to continue the dribble.
RULING: A team-control foul is charged to A1. It is not a player control foul as the contact occurred during an interrupted dribble. (4-19-7)
Soooo....I see where it says a team ctl foul might be a PC foul. I don't see where it says a PC fouls is NOT a TC foul, which is what I questioned from Juulie's original post.

By looking at the definition (NFHS & NCAA) I don't see how a PC foul is not a TC foul.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:15pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan_ref
Soooo....I see where it says a team ctl foul might be a PC foul. I don't see where it says a PC fouls is NOT a TC foul, which is what I questioned from Juulie's original post.

By looking at the definition (NFHS & NCAA) I don't see how a PC foul is not a TC foul.

Since we don't shoot the bonus on either a player of team control foul why does it really matter?
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:18pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RonRef
Since we don't shoot the bonus on either a player of team control foul why does it really matter?
It matters because of the way Juulie defined it.

Do you agree with her?
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:18pm
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Ron, I think you're missing Dan's point. Juulie's post indicated that a team control foul has two conditions: 1) it is a foul by a player whose team is in control AND (2) the player who commits the foul does not have player control.

Dan's point is that the second part of that explanation is incorrect. The player MAY not have the ball; but there is still team control even if s/he does have player control. So a foul by the player in control of the ball is still a team foul, even tho it is also a player control foul. Therefore, a player control foul is a subset of team control fouls.

Both your citations are correct, but miss Dan's point.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:19pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckElias
Ron, I think you're missing Dan's point. Juulie's post indicated that a team control foul has two conditions: 1) it is a foul by a player whose team is in control AND (2) the player who commits the foul does not have player control.

Dan's point is that the second part of that explanation is incorrect. The player MAY not have the ball; but there is still team control even if s/he does have player control. So a foul by the player in control of the ball is still a team foul, even tho it is also a player control foul. Therefore, a player control foul is a subset of team control fouls.

Both your citations are correct, but miss Dan's point.
Speaking of being missed...we miss you in the baseball thread.

You coming back any time soon?
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:20pm
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I guess Dan can handle his own defense. I chimed in a little too late.
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Old Mon Aug 21, 2006, 12:21pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChuckElias
I guess Dan can handle his own defense. I chimed in a little too late.
Yeah, we're both wasting time here.

Why don't we wander over to the baseball thread, I'll buy you a diet coke!

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