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Old Tue Oct 31, 2006, 05:02pm
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Throw In after Made Basket

I just started officiating a two year ago so I'm fairly new. I'm not sure if this applies to most officials when they start, but I got most of my basketball rules knowledge from watching the NBA and some from NCAA. Now that I'm a high school official, I'm trying not to confuse myself with NBA rules anymore.

Here's the question. Is there anywhere in the rulebook that addresses throw-in violations after a made basket? Like say the player throwing the ball in doesn't completely step out of bounds or has at least one foot on the endline when he throws. If it's a violation, I'm assuming the penalty is loss of possession.

Also, should a violation be called in situations like: (1) Team B just made a basket. A1 picks up the ball for the throw-in, has the ball ready to throw for about 1-2 seconds, then A2 grabs the ball from A1 OOB and decides to do the throw-in himself. (2) Same as #1 except A1 PASSES the ball to A2 OOB to do the switch. Does the length of time A1 has the ball ready for the throw-in have anything to do with it?
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Old Tue Oct 31, 2006, 05:15pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
Is there anywhere in the rulebook that addresses throw-in violations after a made basket? Like say the player throwing the ball in doesn't completely step out of bounds...
Yep. 4-42, 7-5, and 7-6.

Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
..or has at least one foot on the endline when he throws.
This isn't a violation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
If it's a violation, I'm assuming the penalty is loss of possession.
Yup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
Also, should a violation be called in situations like:

(1) Team B just made a basket. A1 picks up the ball for the throw-in, has the ball ready to throw for about 1-2 seconds, then A2 grabs the ball from A1 OOB and decides to do the throw-in himself.
No violation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
(2) Same as #1 except A1 PASSES the ball to A2 OOB to do the switch.
No violation.

Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
Does the length of time A1 has the ball ready for the throw-in have anything to do with it?
Yep, they have 5 seconds to complete the throw-in.

Last edited by tjones1; Tue Oct 31, 2006 at 05:17pm.
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Old Tue Oct 31, 2006, 05:24pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77

Here's the question. Is there anywhere in the rulebook that addresses throw-in violations after a made basket? Like say the player throwing the ball in doesn't completely step out of bounds or has at least one foot on the endline when he throws. If it's a violation, I'm assuming the penalty is loss of possession.

Also, should a violation be called in situations like: (1) Team B just made a basket. A1 picks up the ball for the throw-in, has the ball ready to throw for about 1-2 seconds, then A2 grabs the ball from A1 OOB and decides to do the throw-in himself. (2) Same as #1 except A1 PASSES the ball to A2 OOB to do the switch. Does the length of time A1 has the ball ready for the throw-in have anything to do with it?
Read all the cases book plays under THROW-IN VIOLATIONS on p67 of the case book. Then read the case plays in rule 7 - OUT OF BOUNDS AND THE THROW-IN- starting on p. 53 of the case book. That's an easier way to learn than asking individual questions.
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Old Tue Oct 31, 2006, 05:32pm
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Originally Posted by actuary77
Is there anywhere in the rulebook that addresses throw-in violations after a made basket? Like say the player throwing the ball in doesn't completely step out of bounds...

Quote:
Originally Posted by tjones1
Yep. 4-42, 7-5, and 7-6.
I'll add that most of 9-2 applies too, although some provisions are only for designated-spot throw-ins.


Originally Posted by actuary77
..or has at least one foot on the endline when he throws.




Quote:
Originally Posted by tjones1
This isn't a violation.
That may not be true. It depends upon where the other foot is. If it is touching inbounds then this is a violation. If it is in the air and not touching the floor, then this is legal.


The rest of what tanner posted is good.
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Old Tue Oct 31, 2006, 08:21pm
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True, thanks Nevada for clearing that up. I wasn't thinking about that, I was assuming one foot was behind the endline and the other was just touching the endline.
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Old Wed Nov 01, 2006, 01:56am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by actuary77
Here's the question. Is there anywhere in the rulebook that addresses throw-in violations after a made basket? Like say the player throwing the ball in doesn't completely step out of bounds ...
JR gave you great advice in telling you to read the case book plays on throw-ins, but since you specifically asked about this play here is the proper case book ruling for it.


9.2.2 SITUATION C: A1 scores a basket. After the ball goes through the net, B1 grabs it and makes a move toward the end line as though preparing to make a throw-in. However, B1 never legally steps out of bounds, both feet remain inbounds. B1 immediately passes the ball up the court to a fast-breaking teammate, who scores a basket. RULING: Cancel Team B's goal, throw-in violation on B1. The ball was at B1's disposal after the made basket to make a throw-in. B1 must be out of bounds to make a legal throw-in. (7-4-3; 7-5-7)
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Old Wed Nov 01, 2006, 07:56pm
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Also, remember that only one foot has to be down. A player may step OOB with one foot, leave the other foot in the air hovering over the part of the court that is in bounds, and make his/her throw in. This legal, even if the foot on the floor is touching the OOB line itself. The line is OOB, so it's legal.
You'll see courts with really thick OOB lines (I've seen them as much as 3 feet wide), or with simply a change in paint color instead of a "line" per se.
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Old Thu Nov 02, 2006, 11:13pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nevadaref
JR gave you great advice in telling you to read the case book plays on throw-ins, but since you specifically asked about this play here is the proper case book ruling for it.


9.2.2 SITUATION C: A1 scores a basket. After the ball goes through the net, B1 grabs it and makes a move toward the end line as though preparing to make a throw-in. However, B1 never legally steps out of bounds, both feet remain inbounds. B1 immediately passes the ball up the court to a fast-breaking teammate, who scores a basket. RULING: Cancel Team B's goal, throw-in violation on B1. The ball was at B1's disposal after the made basket to make a throw-in. B1 must be out of bounds to make a legal throw-in. (7-4-3; 7-5-7)
Umm...let me get this straight - you can cancel a basket because you can go back in time and call a violation?

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Old Fri Nov 03, 2006, 04:30am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells
Also, remember that only one foot has to be down. A player may step OOB with one foot, leave the other foot in the air hovering over the part of the court that is in bounds, and make his/her throw in.
Hey, didn't I write that the day before?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Snaqwells
This legal, even if the foot on the floor is touching the OOB line itself. The line is OOB, so it's legal.
You'll see courts with really thick OOB lines (I've seen them as much as 3 feet wide), or with simply a change in paint color instead of a "line" per se.
This is a good point.
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Old Fri Nov 03, 2006, 04:30am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M&M Guy
Umm...let me get this straight - you can cancel a basket because you can go back in time and call a violation?

Certainly seems that way. Of course, the official must actually CALL the violation!
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Old Fri Jan 04, 2008, 12:07am
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Inbound After Made Basket - Feet Over Line

Hey Guys,

Related to this thread, I play in a league that uses modified NCAA rules.

Tonight a ref called a violation on me while I was inbounding after a made basket because I did not have BOTH feet ofer the endline, one of my feet was lifted and in the air, and over the endline.

I have read the rules, and nearly exploded, positive that I was right. I have read the rulebook cover to cover and pay attention to officiating in all games that I watch on TV. I actually reffed a bit in college for an intramural league.

The ref told me that I better just follow his rule the rest of the game because he was going to call it the same way from that point on. I told him ok.

After the game I went over and told him that I disagreed with his ruling and asked if he would double check his position in the rule book before the games next week - he responded by giving me advice on my game. That really made me mad. Shouldn't he say that he would at least look into it?

I know a players position on the court is determined by the last place where they touched, and this is what I am basing my ruling on. Could you please point out what sections of the rule book I can print out to make my case the strongest?

Thanks,
Todd Lynch
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Old Fri Jan 04, 2008, 09:16am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlynch
I know a players position on the court is determined by the last place where they touched, and this is what I am basing my ruling on. Could you please point out what sections of the rule book I can print out to make my case the strongest?

Thanks,
Todd Lynch
Sometimes you get RecLeague Refs at Rec League Games. Still, you shouldnt' "nearly explode" at the call. Any correction will be best received if it comes from the supervisor / assignor, and not from a player.

Throw-ins are rule 7. Throw-in violations are rule 9-2.
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Old Fri Jan 04, 2008, 11:52am
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Rule 7 - Section 1 - Art. 1.

A player shall be out of bounds when he or she touches the floor or any object other than a player on or outside a boundary line. An airborn playerís status shall be where he or she was last in contact with the floor.

-----------------------

Rule 7 - Section 5 - Art. 8.

After a goal as listed in Rule 7-4.1.c, the team not credited with the score shall make the throw-in from the end of the court where the goal was made and from any point outside the end line.

a. Any player of the throw-in team may make a direct throw-in or may pass the ball along the end line to a teammate who is also out of bounds.

---------------------

Rule 9 - Section 5 - A.R. 182.

During a throw-in by Team A, (a) A1ís foot breaks the plane of the boundary line or (b) A1ís hand(s) and the ball break the plane of the boundary line.

RULING: No violation in either (a) or (b).



=================================================

Are there any other articles that deal with the issue of inbounding with just one foot over the endline, quickly, to ignite a fastbreak? 9-5-182 makes it pretty clear but I hope to send a well formed email to the commissioner so the rule can be called consistently.

I just noticed - If you combine 7-5-8 (end line to a teammate who is also out of bounds.) with 7-5-1, it would seem that a teammate receiving the pass could be standing with one foot inbounds and one foot out of bounds, as the player would, by 7-5-1, be 'out of bounds'.
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Old Fri Jan 04, 2008, 12:00pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tlynch
I just noticed - If you combine 7-5-8 (end line to a teammate who is also out of bounds.) with 7-5-1, it would seem that a teammate receiving the pass could be standing with one foot inbounds and one foot out of bounds, as the player would, by 7-5-1, be 'out of bounds'.
the player throwing the pass wouldn't be in violation, but the player receiving it would be.
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Old Fri Jan 04, 2008, 12:05pm
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Mr. Lynch,

In your first post, the official is wrong, but as already noted this is a rec league so what do you expect an NBA quality referee? Here is the case book play stating that only one foot must be keep on or over the designated-spot.

7.6.2 SITUATION: A1 is out of bounds for a designated-spot throw-in. The administering official has designated the spot and put the ball at A1's disposal. In order to avoid some of the defensive pressure near the throw-in spot, A1 takes several steps directly backward, but keeps one foot on or over the designated area prior to releasing the ball on a throw-in pass. RULING: Legal throw-in. It is permissible for the thrower to move backward or forward within the 3-foot-wide designated area without violating and he/she may move laterally if at least one foot is kept on or over the designated area until the ball is released. The thrower may also jump vertically and pass from the designated throw-in spot. COMMENT: Pivot-foot restrictions and the traveling rule are not in effect for a throw-in. The thrower must keep one foot on or over the spot until the ball is released.
-------------------------
And this one tells you that it is only illegal if BOTH FEET remain inbounds.

9.2.2 SITUATION C: A1 scores a basket. After the ball goes through the net, B1 grabs it and makes a move toward the end line as though preparing to make a throw-in. However, B1 never legally steps out of bounds, both feet remain inbounds. B1 immediately passes the ball up the court to a fast-breaking teammate, who scores a basket. RULING: Cancel Team B's goal, throw-in violation on B1. The ball was at B1's disposal after the made basket to make a throw-in. B1 must be out of bounds to make a legal throw-in. (7-4-3; 7-5-7)
--------------------------
Quote:
Originally Posted by tlynch
I just noticed - If you combine 7-5-8 (end line to a teammate who is also out of bounds.) with 7-5-1, it would seem that a teammate receiving the pass could be standing with one foot inbounds and one foot out of bounds, as the player would, by 7-5-1, be 'out of bounds'.

For this last question, you need to understand that it would be a violation per either of these two rulings depending upon the situation:

a. 9.2.5 SITUATION: Thrower A1 inadvertently steps through the plane of the boundary line and touches the court inbounds. A1 immediately steps back into normal out-of-bounds throw-in position. The contact with the court was during a situation: (a) with; or (b) without defensive pressure on the throw-in team. RULING: A violation in both (a) and (b). COMMENT: Whether or not there was defensive pressure or whether or not stepping on the court was inadvertent, it is a violation and no judgment is required in making the call.

b. 2007-08 Basketball Rules Interpretations
SITUATION 3: During an alternating-possession throw-in for Team A, thrower A1 passes the ball directly on the court where it contacts (a) A2 or (b) B2, while he/she is standing on a boundary line. RULING: Out-of-bounds violation on (a) A2; (b) B2. The player was touched by the ball while out of bounds, thereby ending the throw-in. The alternating-possession arrow is reversed and pointed toward Team B's basket when the throw-in ends (when A2/B2 is touched by the ball). A throw-in is awarded at a spot nearest the out-of-bounds violation for (a) Team B; (b) Team A. (4-42-5; 6-4-4; 9-2-2; 9-3-2)
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