Dreaded BLARGE!

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by tjones1

Oh well...maybe someday I'll be on the Rules Committee.

I might vote for you, if you change your MLB party affiliation...

There's pluses and minuses for both ways. In HS, if you have a coach look at you and say, "But your partner called it a different way...", you can say, "Yep, we've got that call too." Both coaches are happy/unhappy. But I still don't understand how you can have both a player-control foul and a block, by rule. In NCAA-W, you still have the issue of trying to explain to one coach why the call that favored them was taken away. It may or may not be the "right" call, depending on who's primary, who had the best look, who's the stronger official, etc. In theory, I like the NCAA-W practice, but even it has drawbacks.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

But I still don't understand how you can have both a player-control foul and a block, by rule.

Charge and Block, not possible...either the defender was in position or not....still a double foul is called since neither official has the authority to overrule the other. Both calls stand.

Player Control and Block, easy. B1 sticks out a knee clipping A1 while, at the very same time, A1 is hooking B1. There are two different contacts that are not mutually exclusive.

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Charge and Block, not possible...either the defender was in position or not....still a double foul is called since neither official has the authority to overrule the other. Both calls stand.

Player Control and Block, easy. B1 sticks out a knee clipping A1 while, at the very same time, A1 is hooking B1. There are two different contacts that are not mutually exclusive.

Camron - the block/charge was what I had in mind when I made that statement; that's probably where 99% of these types of double-whistles will occur. I don't think it's an issue of one official overruling another as much as it is getting together to determine which one was right. There's already a similar precedence when you have one official signal a foul, and another signals a violation. You cetainly don't penalize both players in that double-whistle situation. Usually one official will come in and say, "The foul caused the player to travel, so I've got the foul!" It's picking one call and going with that. It just seems a little unusual that they picked only the block/charge double-whistle to go with the penalizing of both, especially since there is the issue of the defender either has the position, or they don't.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Camron - the block/charge was what I had in mind when I made that statement; that's probably where 99% of these types of double-whistles will occur. I don't think it's an issue of one official overruling another as much as it is getting together to determine which one was right. There's already a similar precedence when you have one official signal a foul, and another signals a violation. You cetainly don't penalize both players in that double-whistle situation. Usually one official will come in and say, "The foul caused the player to travel, so I've got the foul!" It's picking one call and going with that. It just seems a little unusual that they picked only the block/charge double-whistle to go with the penalizing of both, especially since there is the issue of the defender either has the position, or they don't.

The difference is that the violation/foul double whistle are two differnet infractions, neither of which conflicts with the other. Determing which came first is all that must be determined and shouldn't be too hard to do.

The block/charge is two different interpretations of the same action. It is a judgement call. It's not matter of which came first but a determination of who is right. To determine a "right" call will usually require more information than is possible to have. More often than not, it would require that one official simply yield to the other.

[Kevzebra]

The NCAA Women's crews never have a blarge! Why? Cause we get together and decide where the play happened (primary) and go with that. Too many times officials that have no business looking at a play come up with something that he/she should not have!

I remember a play from our regional (HS) semi final last year (I was watching it) and a "player control foul" occured at the free throw line. The center had a GREAT look at the play comes up with a the correct call, but here was the lead, looking 15 feet out from the baseline and calling a block (oh, BTW, he went to the state tourney 2 years ago). So the lesson here is; if you do have a double whistle, do NOT give a prelim signal. Get with your partner and decide. Might look bad for one of you (but you can always say you had the same thing) and get the call right!

[deecee]

I dont remember if this question has been answered and I assume its the same as with a jump ball -- on a double foul (any of them) where we go to the POI and the offense retains possession do we reset the shot clock?

[Junker]

I think the women's side has this right. Ideally at any level, an official should have his or her fist in the air on all fouls before coming with a mechanic. I know we all slip and get excited to sell a call from time to time, but if officials slow down the way they do things, the blarge should not happen in my opinion.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by deecee

I dont remember if this question has been answered and I assume its the same as with a jump ball -- on a double foul (any of them) where we go to the POI and the offense retains possession do we reset the shot clock?

If there is team control at the time of the double foul, no reset. NCAA 2-14-7f.