disposal of the shooter

[oc]

From association meeting last night:

Exactly when does the ball become at the disposal of the free throw shooter? After the Ref bounces the ball or after the ball gets to the shooter?

At stake here is whether or not the ball being bouned to the shooter is live or not and whether or not team B can step into the lane and call a time-out while the ball is being bounced to the shooter but not reached them yet.

FYI-I said team B can still call a time-out up until the time the ball actually reaches the shooter, but I can't find anything in the book to confirm or deny this. The only thing I am going on is an IAABO question from a few years ago but I don't think I have a copy of it anymore.

[ChuckElias]

When it's caught by the shooter. FED 4-4-7b. NCAA 4-16-1b.

[Back In The Saddle]

The rule isn't crystal clear:
Rule 8 Free Throw

SECTION 1 FREE-THROW ADMINISTRATION

ART. 1 . . . When a free throw is awarded, the ball shall be placed at the disposal of the free thrower (bounced) by the administering official and the free throw count shall begin. Either or both teams may be charged with a violation.


So, if you declare it "at the disposal" of the thrower when the ref releases the bounce pass, then you gotta start counting 10 before the thrower even gets it. And you have to consider any last-second lane changes to be violations. Those would be the down sides; I don't see any up sides.

It would also be inconsistent with the (awarded) throw-in where the ball isn't at the disposal of the thrower until it is physically available to him/her.

So put me down for the ball being "at the disposal" when the thrower has, or should have, physical possession of it.

[ChuckElias]

Bits, check out the cites I posted. It's crystal clear.

[Back In The Saddle]

Or, you can do it Chuck's way

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by ChuckElias

When it's caught by the shooter. FED 4-5-7b. NCAA 4-16-1b.

Typo- sb 4-4-7b.

[oc]

Originally Posted by ChuckElias

When it's caught by the shooter. FED 4-5-7b. NCAA 4-16-1b.

Yep that's pretty clear. Thanks.

[ChuckElias]

Originally Posted by Jurassic Referee

Typo- sb 4-4-7b.

Yep, sorry about that. I guess I looked at the first section on the page, which was 5. I'll go edit it.

[Adam]

Why are we disposing of the shooter? Did he rat someone out?

[M&M Guy]

Originally Posted by Snaqwells

Why are we disposing of the shooter? Did he rat someone out?

Ehh...Tony S. said 'da guy wasn't bein' cooperative, if 'ya know wat I mean.

If the count did start on the bounce, just think of the fun we would have if the shooter decided to not catch it, and goes bouncing down to the other end of the floor as we're counting...

[rockyroad]

Watching my son play summer league ball last night...two shots awarded, everyone lines up, Lead steps in, says "Two" and starts to bounce ball to shooter. Meanwhile, coach is yelling at my son "Caleb, you're supposed to be back on D. Get back there." So dutiful son turns and runs down the court. Trail hits whistle, shooter then catches ball and turns with puzzled look, trail gets sheepish look and says "Oops." Lead gets ball back and administers all over again. Good thing "disposal" doesn't start until shooter catches the ball

[Back In The Saddle]

Originally Posted by M&M Guy

Ehh...Tony S. said 'da guy wasn't bein' cooperative, if 'ya know wat I mean.

If the count did start on the bounce, just think of the fun we would have if the shooter decided to not catch it, and goes bouncing down to the other end of the floor as we're counting...

If the shooter just decided not to catch the bounce (perhaps he's angry at the call), I'd think about starting my count at that point. Then if he noticed that and steped out of the semi circle to go get the ball, I'd think about calling that too. But then, I've got a belligerent streak in me

[oc]

Originally Posted by Back In The Saddle

If the shooter just decided not to catch the bounce (perhaps he's angry at the call), I'd think about starting my count at that point. Then if he noticed that and steped out of the semi circle to go get the ball, I'd think about calling that too. But then, I've got a belligerent streak in me

I don't usually see shooters angry at the call.--one of the players on the line for the rebound might not have liked the call-but the shooters are pretty happy with the calls I made (at least the most recent call.)

[26 Year Gap]

A friend of mine noticed that a fellow official would announce "Shoot two" or "Shoot One" as he was administering the FTs. It was a scrimmage that caught his ear and afterwards, he went up to the official who he knew quite well and said,"Bruce, I'm confused. When you were administering FTs and said 'Shoot two' which two did you mean? There's three of you." Bruce no longer says "Shoot Two" or "Shoot One."