Coaches Biggest Problem With New Rules ...

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by SC Official

Ah, another holier-than-thou remark.

Not necessarily holier than thou. I just can't stand officials that think they are above stepping on a court for free and doing so is above them.

Mens rec league? I get it. I just believe in helping people out while taking the opportunity to get better and get some rust off. Let's not forget that it can also help you in the long run when the prime contracts are needing officials.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SD Referee

Let's not forget that it can also help you in the long run ...

Back when we were working free scrimmages, I'm sure that many officials kept in mind that here in Connecticut coaches vote for state tournament officials.

"Who was that guy that worked our scrimmage for free? BobbyMac, or something like that? Yeah sure, let's vote for BobbyMac.

Damn, I knew that I should have signed the book. But there was no book at the table. It was only a scrimmage. Next time I'll wear a name tag.

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

Back when we were working free scrimmages, I'm sure that many officials kept in mind that here in Connecticut coaches vote for state tournament officials.

"Who was that guy that worked our scrimmage for free? BobbyMac, or something like that? Yeah sure, let's vote for BobbyMac.

Damn, I knew that I should have signed the book. But there was no book at the table. It was only a scrimmage. Next time I'll wear a name tag.

Our coaches don't get to vote for state tournament officials. I guess that can be a good and bad thing. Probably mostly good that they don't vote.

[SC Official]

Originally Posted by SD Referee

Not necessarily holier than thou. I just can't stand officials that think they are above stepping on a court for free and doing so is above them.

Mens rec league? I get it. I just believe in helping people out while taking the opportunity to get better and get some rust off. Let's not forget that it can also help you in the long run when the prime contracts are needing officials.

You implied he didn't care about getting better because he didn't want to work for free and valued his time by doing things other than officiating free scrimmages. Sorry, but not everyone lives to officiate high school basketball.

So yes, you were being holier-than-thou.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by SC Official

You implied he didn't care about getting better because he didn't want to work for free and valued his time by doing things other than officiating free scrimmages. Sorry, but not everyone lives to officiate high school basketball.



So yes, you were being holier-than-thou.

Frankly, this mindset (not yours, but the "for the kids" one) has kept game fees low while teams seem to be able to afford new uniforms seemingly every year.

We have conferences who have raised fees only $10 over the last 25+ years.

There's no shame in wanting to be paid for our work. Schools see value in having officials and not coaches with whistles for scrimmages. Officials should be paid for their time and labor just like in any other job.


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[SC Official]

Originally Posted by Rich

Frankly, this mindset (not yours, but the "for the kids" one) has kept game fees low while teams seem to be able to afford new uniforms seemingly every year.

We have conferences who have raised fees only $10 over the last 25+ years.

There's no shame in wanting to be paid for our work. Schools see value in having officials and not coaches with whistles for scrimmages. Officials should be paid for their time and labor just like in any other job.

Exactly. It's also a large part of why conditions/pay in offseason tournaments haven't gotten better.

If the schools want free officials, let the parents who b*tch in the stands do it.

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by SC Official

You implied he didn't care about getting better because he didn't want to work for free and valued his time by doing things other than officiating free scrimmages. Sorry, but not everyone lives to officiate high school basketball.

So yes, you were being holier-than-thou.

Agree to disagree. The way I took his response, and why I hate communicating online, is that we was above doing an officiating for free. To each his own, but I truly believe that we should all volunteer to some degree with the skills and knowledge we have.

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by SD Referee

Not necessarily holier than thou. I just can't stand officials that think they are above stepping on a court for free and doing so is above them.

Mens rec league? I get it. I just believe in helping people out while taking the opportunity to get better and get some rust off. Let's not forget that it can also help you in the long run when the prime contracts are needing officials.

What does above or beneath have to do with it? Maybe some officials already volunteer and help people out in other aspects of life, and don't feel like doing it for sports. Maybe some officials spend money on camps in the off-season and don't feel they should also have to spend more of their free time on a court without getting compensated. Maybe the teams that are scrimmaging are teams that traditionally treat official like crap. Maybe some officials feel they should get compensated for their services and talents because this is a business. Maybe some officials have spouses who tolerate the paid gigs but aren't too understanding when their significant other is away from home volunteering more time on the court.

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by Raymond

What does above or beneath have to do with it? Maybe some officials already volunteer and help people out in other aspects of life, and don't feel like doing it for sports. Maybe some officials spend money on camps in the off-season and don't feel they should also have to spend more of their free time on a court without getting compensated. Maybe the teams that are scrimmaging are teams that traditionally treat official like crap. Maybe some officials feel they should get compensated for their services and talents because this is a business. Maybe some officials have spouses who tolerate the paid gigs but aren't too understanding when their significant other is away from home volunteering more time on the court.

Perhaps. Nobody will say you are wrong, but we were talking about volunteering/doing scrimmages. Nobody brought up the long list of "maybes" that you did. To each their own.

Sounds like the difference between you and me is I don't view officiating as a "business". I already have a career. Officiating is a fun hobby that makes me a little money while getting exercise. Getting paid to exercise!!!!! It's quite unbelievable! I just believe that volunteering/working for free for me has been far more beneficial than not. It doesn't make a better person/official by choosing to do so.

[BillyMac]

As much as I love officiating, with some exceptions, I wouldn't do it for free.

Fees, traffic, fines, dues, traffic, insurance, traffic, travel, traffic, meetings, traffic, camps, traffic, clinics, traffic, uniforms, traffic, shoes, traffic, equipment bags.

[Camron Rust]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

As much as I love officiating, with some exceptions, I wouldn't do it for free.

Fees, traffic, fines, dues, traffic, insurance, traffic, travel, traffic, meetings, traffic, camps, traffic, clinics, traffic, uniforms, traffic, shoes, traffic, equipment bags.

Did you consider traffic?

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by Camron Rust

Did you consider traffic?

It's New England, "You can't get there from here".

My local area is bisected by the mighty Connecticut River, with only a few bridges that cross the river, forcing one to travel through heavily congested rush hour traffic on the few major highway bridges that cross the river. No such thing as a back road shortcut.

And the two ferries don't run in the winter.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

And the two ferries don't run in the winter.

This is what we call a "ferry" in Connecticut:



It's the nation's oldest (1655) continuously operating ferry service, more of a tourist attraction than a mode of transportation.

[SD Referee]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

As much as I love officiating, with some exceptions, I wouldn't do it for free.

Fees, traffic, fines, dues, traffic, insurance, traffic, travel, traffic, meetings, traffic, camps, traffic, clinics, traffic, uniforms, traffic, shoes, traffic, equipment bags.

Ha ha ha!!!!!!! Yeah I suppose it takes longer to get a game than it would take to actually do a game and makes volunteering not worth it. Not really a problem where I live.

I'm curious about a few things you listed. What do you mean by "fines" and "insurance"? Part of our fee that we pay the state to be an official goes for insurance. That's the only insurance anybody has here.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by SD Referee

I'm curious about a few things you listed. What do you mean by "fines" and "insurance"?

Many IAABO boards have access to voluntary supplemental insurance provided by the Borden Perlman Insurance Agency. It's a bargain at $7.00 each year, especially the death benefit for those without life insurance that could help a family pay for a funeral, and the accident insurance for those that don't have their own medical insurance.

Accident Medical
$25,000 Excess Accident Limit
$25,000 Physical Therapy
$25,000 Dental
$10,000 Accidental Death
Liability $5,000,000 Per Official/Per Location
Game Fee Reimbursement
100% of Game Fee up to $50 per game
$2,000 Max Payout

We have a "laundry list" of fines:

Missed game assignments – full game fee
Game turn-back due to not blocking date in the Arbiter - $15
Arbiter Late Partner Evaluation (submitted more than 7 calendar days from assigned game date): 2 to 3 Late or Missed - $25 Total; 4 or more Late or Missed - $50 Total
Missed Meeting(s): A fine of $25 will be assessed for each meeting not attended beyond one permitted missed meeting.

My first year, in ancient times © Mark T. DeNucci, Sr., 2018, the new guys were often assigned to work some men's recreation leagues (no more). I forgot to put a triple header on my calendar, and was a no show. I could of been fined three game fees, a steep penalty (plus I lost the three game fees, in essence a six game fee fine) for a low paid (at the time) teacher with a young family, but our treasurer took pity on me and only fined me a single game fee, dodged a bullet there.

We also have late fees, and possible assignment penalties (half season, full season), for paying one's dues, fees, or fines, late, or if one bounces a check.

Membership Dues Late Payment Fee - $50
Game Assignment Fee (7%) Late Payment Fee - $50
Late Payment For All Fines Fee - $50
Returned check fee is $25

Penalty for Non-Compliance Membership Dues and Game Assignment Fee
If not paid by April 4 – Eligible for Assignments January 15
If not paid by May 1 – No assignments for the entire season

Penalty for Non-Compliance with Fines
No Assignments for the entire season (if not paid within 60 days of Fine letter)

We have a new one. Attendance at the year end banquet requires a $20 deposit that you get back when you attend the banquet. We were paying for too many "no show plates" each year.

I had a last minute family emergency last year and lost my $20. I wonder if I can deduct that from my taxes as a business expense. I'll check with my tax accountants, Dewey, Cheatem & Howe.