Response to player protests

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by SC Official

I respect protesters' message even if I don't agree with it or I don't agree with the method.

But what I think people get wrong is the scope to which the First Amendment applies. It protects no right to free speech on your employer's dime. It also definitely protects no right to free speech in your capacity as an independent contractor.

Officials that choose to do this have no "rights" to assert if an assigner shows them the door. All this talk I hear about "rights" on social media and television–it's just not true in many cases.

Yes, that is true, but employers are not going to get rid of players they have a "contact" with or have nothing in the CBA to take action with just cause. So the First Amendment only involves the government and action from the government. When Trump opened his mouth, he kind of used his position to take action against the players. The owners and players took action at least in the NFL situation.

Peace

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

...

I have a political position on many things. If you are like some here you know that if you see my page, I can be very political. But it is not my place to tell those what to do personally with their politics outside of the game. I am also a person that officiated both a football and basketball game at a school whose mascot was the "Rebel Flag" and as an African-American who is deeply offended by that flag, I said nothing in my role as an official. I did my job and moved on. And that alone is much more offensive than some kneeling during the Anthem.

Peace

I agree wholeheartedly with this. I would be deeply offended if any iteration of the "Southern pride" flag posted next to our nation's colors during the national anthem. But I would still officiate the game, and then request not to be sent back to that school.

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Raymond

I agree wholeheartedly with this. I would be deeply offended if any iteration of the "Southern pride" flag posted next to our nation's colors during the national anthem. But I would still officiate the game, and then request not to be sent back to that school.

An appropriate response, and one I would take as well.

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

My father is buried in a Veteran Cemetery and I grew up respecting this flag, but I had a mother that was in the Civil Rights Movement where she was in a lawsuit for discrimination when they segregated a school in Florida. So I want this country to uphold the standards they have set.

JRutledge: You should be very proud of both of your parents. Very proud. They're both heroes.

During World War II, my Dad, my hero, an Army Staff Sergeant, fought his way from North Africa, across Sicily, and up the Apennine Mountains in Italy, over some of Europe's most difficult terrain under some of the worst weather conditions found anywhere during World War II. He was eventually awarded a medal for his heroism in the Battle of Rome (after which he traded his carbine for a typewriter after the Army discovered that he went to business school and could type).

As kids, every national holiday (they weren't always on Mondays back then) my Dad proudly displayed our family's (all three of his bothers served) American Flag, and he made a point of telling my brother and me why he was displaying the flag on that particular special day. He's no longer with us, so I can't be certain, but I'm pretty sure that he didn't risk his life and didn't fight his way across Italy for a piece of red, white, and blue colored cloth, or a poem matched with music from a British song, both that symbolized liberty, freedom, and justice; but rather, for the actual liberty, actual freedom, and actual justice (not just symbols) that we have in this wonderful country.

"With liberty and justice for all". Remember when we all recited that at the beginning of school every day? Did we mean it?

[Raymond]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

JRutledge: You should be very proud of both of your parents. Very proud. They're both heroes.

During World War II, my Dad, my hero, an Army Staff Sergeant, fought his way from North Africa, across Sicily, and up the Apennine Mountains in Italy, over some of Europe's most difficult terrain under some of the worst weather conditions found anywhere during World War II. He was eventually awarded a medal for his heroism in the Battle of Rome (after which he traded his carbine for a typewriter after the Army discovered that he went to business school and could type).

As kids, every national holiday (they weren't always on Mondays back then) my Dad proudly displayed our family's (all three of his bothers served) American Flag, and he made a point of telling my brother and me why he was displaying the flag on that particular special day. He's no longer with us, so I can't be certain, but I'm pretty sure that he didn't risk his life and didn't fight his way across Italy for a piece of red, white, and blue colored cloth, or a poem matched with music from a British song, that symbolized liberty, freedom, and justice; but rather, for the actual liberty, freedom, and justice, that we have in this wonderful country.

"With liberty and justice for all". Remember when we all recited that at the beginning of school every day? Did we mean it?

Your best post ever.

[rockyroad]

Originally Posted by Kelvin green

Here's a couple of random thoughts....

1) Free speech generally protects an individual from government interference with that speech. Where i am the overwhelming majority of schools are public school and are part of the government. While schools can get involved with free speech issues more than other governments, i am contracted by that entity and will not do anything that will expand or detract from my contractual responsibilities or make the situation worse because I am a contractor.

2) Although i might disagree with the tactics... and although what I see as disrespect pains me and disturbs me and .. I wonder how many many of these individuals truly understand what is means to be free or if they understand how privileged they are compared to the rest of the world....

but at the end of the day I know that as someone who has served in the oldest military organization in the country for nearly 39 years, someone who has taken an oath to support and defend the Constitution, an oath that pledges even my life in its defense that in part its been me that has answered the call of this country to ensure that they have the ability to protest in this manner.

Are there problems with the country? Yep... are we perfect? Nope! But we have it better than many across the world. Much of the controversy is generated because we have little respect for each other... if we worked on respect for each other.... if we showed respect for the flag and our respected institutions we may be able to come together to resolve our differences.

I am a defender of of their peaceful right to protest no matter how much it pains me.

Thank you for your service! Saying thanks isn't nearly enough...

[Jqb12]

Kelvin Green...............great post man!

[Rich]

I'll say it over and over again, too. I support any player who wishes to express him or herself in this way at any level.

As an official it's none of my damned business.

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[WhistlesAndStripes]

Here’s another one:

http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/local...lowTwt_NYBrand


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[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by Whistles & Stripes

Here’s another one:

NJ Referees Refuse to Work High School Game Over Anthem Protest - NBC New York


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I read about this yesterday on another website. All I can say that fathers are supposed to set good examples for their children and this father did not set a good example for his son.

MTD, Sr.

[BillyMac]

STUDENT-ATHLETE/COACH NATIONAL ANTHEM POSTURES.

Media reports from various areas have recounted several instances where high school game officials have reacted
publicly to student-athletes and/or coaches kneeling in silent protest during the playing of the national anthem
before a game. This fall, it was reported that two officials, at a pre-match meeting with coaches threatened to
disqualify any players who did not demonstrate respect for the American flag or the national anthem. In another
instance, an official observed a player kneeling during the anthem and proceeded to advise a coach that he was
leaving the gym. In yet another game, after witnessing players kneeling during the anthem two officials left the
field, leaving the 3 remaining officials, — allegedly not without verbalizing his objection to kneeling players and
their coach. After the game, the media reported that the coach claimed that, before the game the Referee requested
— on behalf of the officiating crew — that any player who might kneel remain in the locker room “to avoid any
problems.” After the game, one of the departed officials eagerly gave media interviews where he was reported to
have said the chain officials who were called off the sidelines to replace the two officials “…weren’t officially
trained,’” and added that if the kneeling players “weren’t happy in the U.S., they should leave the country.”

These embarrassing and untoward incidents should provide a cautionary tale for IAABO officials everywhere:
IAABO Boards are requested to briefly review with all members a number of fundamental and well-established
principles of officiating; so as to avoid situations where officials denigrate themselves, their fellow officials, and
the game by abdicating their contractual and ethical responsibility to call the game to the best of their ability.

a. Refusing to work a contracted game as a protest after arriving at a game site is not only a breach of a
contract to officiate. Media statements identifying “offending” players and teams are even more
unprofessional. Taken together, these actions are indicative of a lack of understanding of the basic
obligations of a game official.

b. An official needs to remember at all times the reason why he or she is in the gym or the field house in
uniform.

c. There is no provision in the NFHS or any other basketball rules code of which we are aware regarding penalties for kneeling during pre-game ceremonies.

d. Officials may pontificate about honoring the flag and respect — however, failing to honor a contract,
leaving two teams, family and friends, coaches and staff, and one’s officiating partners to ponder the fate
of the game while the official calls attention to himself or herself — is evidence of dishonor and disrespect
of everyone else in the venue.

e. Self-righteous and gratuitous comments regarding pre-game ceremonies, threats to penalize athletes for
actions which do not violate the rules of the game, and denigration of athletes and team personnel in media
statements also serve to destroy the mantle of impartiality on which all officials’ credibility depends.

No guidelines regarding officials who wish to join the protests by kneeling themselves? Interesting.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by BillyMac

No guidelines regarding officials who wish to join the protests by kneeling themselves? Interesting.

They do not need to address something that is not against the rules or likely has not even happen. You are an official that is contracted to do a game. If an official kneels (stay in the locker room or does not put their hand over their heart) they still can and likely will adhere to their contract. No part of our contract requires us to do anything specific during any ceremony before the game that has literally nothing to do with the game. And at least in one case, it would be up to the conference to take action as they are the ones that technically hire the officials and we are independent contractors.

Peace

[BillyMac]

Originally Posted by know

They do not need to address something that is not against the rules or likely has not even happen.

I guess that our local IAABO board would frown upon any protest by an official, and probably the State board as well. For curiosity's sake, I wonder what IAABO International's stand would be on this possibility.

There have to be some officials out there who are sympathetic to the cause.