6 Players penalty

[BigT]

Last night for the first time ever I had a player from team visitor twice run out onto the court.

All we did was apply a team foul shot 2 and gave the offended team the ball.

Texting friends this morning. They all seem to think that it is a team foul, player T and an indirect to the coach.

The book doesn't seem to support this yet sometimes technicals and there different types aren't always clear so I wanted to ask my forum vets.

Thanks in advance

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BigT

Last night for the first time ever I had a player from team visitor twice run out onto the court.

All we did was apply a team foul shot 2 and gave the offended team the ball.

Texting friends this morning. They all seem to think that it is a team foul, player T and an indirect to the coach.

The book doesn't seem to support this yet sometimes technicals and there different types aren't always clear so I wanted to ask my forum vets.

Thanks in advance

If you catch 6 on the floor while being violated it is a TEAM technical. 2 shots ball at division line. It does not go to a player or coach. It does go towards team foul count.

Now, if a sub simply runs onto the floor. That is a SUBSTITUTE technical. It applies toward his five fouls, it is one of his two techs, and toward team foul count. does not go to coach or affect his box in either case.

Rule 10.

[RefsNCoaches]

Wasn't there at one time ...direct and indirect for the HC? 2 directs on HC or 3 indirect would be ejection....I seem to recall that in the rule book at some point in past.

[LRZ]

BigT, look at the Technical-Foul Penalty Summary, near the back of the NFHS rule book.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by RefsNCoaches

Wasn't there at one time ...direct and indirect for the HC? 2 directs on HC or 3 indirect would be ejection....I seem to recall that in the rule book at some point in past.

You have to look at the rules and read over and over. Rule 10 deals with this stuff. There are now administrative technicals, team technicals, substitute technicals, and more etc. Administrative, and team technicals are assessed and apply to team foul count only. Substitute techs apply to the player but not to the coach. If a player dunks in pre game, member of bench personnel, the player gets a T and the coach gets an indirect and loses the box.

Not all Ts are assessed to coach. You need to know what is and isn't.

[BigT]

The sub technical makes sense. Player fails to report and jumps on the court. I dont think I have ever seen it called. Ive seen too many tell them to go report.

This situation its a live ball just after we have started up after a dead ball and she runs onto the court.

This seems more like the definition of team technical.

Have I separated these well.

Thanks everyone for the feedback. The summary was helpful for other things not really for this situation and how to decide which one to use.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BigT

The sub technical makes sense. Player fails to report and jumps on the court. I dont think I have ever seen it called. Ive seen too many tell them to go report.

This situation its a live ball just after we have started up after a dead ball and she runs onto the court.

This seems more like the definition of team technical.

Have I separated these well.

Thanks everyone for the feedback. The summary was helpful for other things not really for this situation and how to decide which one to use.

Read rule 10 over and over and rules 1-9…and all of case book. If a player runs onto court without reporting and you see that or are told that so and so didn't report and just ran out then call it a substitute technical. That player gets a T and it goes toward team foul count. If you just find 6 on the floor and nobody knows what the hell happened then you call T for 6 on floor. That is a team technical. The summary helps after you have read the rules over and over and over…..

[BigT]

Why is the penalty bigger for a dead ball sub coming onto the court vs live ball a player comes flying onto the court..?

[Welpe]

When is the sixth player running on to the court and from where? Directly from their bench?

Originally Posted by BigT

Why is the penalty bigger for a dead ball sub coming onto the court vs live ball a player comes flying onto the court..?

It's not. Why do you think it is?

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BigT

Why is the penalty bigger for a dead ball sub coming onto the court vs live ball a player comes flying onto the court..?

If there is a dead ball and a sub comes in without reporting i will send him to the table to report. i don't want to call that T at any level if i can avoid it. If someone runs onto the floor without reporting during live ball i don't have much choice but to penalize it. Substitute technical.

6 players on court usually occurs because someone doesn't come off the floor after someone else has properly reported. If someone does run on the floor during a live ball and you don't see it, nor does anybody else, and all you know is there are 6 for one team then you call the team technical. you don't know who came in without reporting.

[BigT]

BigCat now that makes sense to me. Your clarification has been awesome.

Thanks for answering ALL my questions and those situations so I know how to properly penalize.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by BigT

BigCat now that makes sense to me. Your clarification has been awesome.

Thanks for answering ALL my questions and those situations so I know how to properly penalize.

not a problem. I/we around here harp on reading rules over and over and case book over and over because they are like a giant puzzle. One aspect is connected to another and others to others. When you read them over and over you start seeing how things fit together and impact other areas.

And the case book is a must. folks only reading the rule book are missing A LOT.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by BigCat

If someone runs onto the floor without reporting during live ball i don't have much choice but to penalize it. Substitute technical.

I think that depends upon where they come from and what they do. This could also be a technical on bench personnel which would result in an indirect to the HC also.

[BigCat]

Originally Posted by Welpe

I think that depends upon where they come from and what they do. This could also be a technical on bench personnel which would result in an indirect to the HC also.

obviously, what's going on at the time matters and his reasons for running on floor. if there's a confrontation on the floor and B6 runs out then he's gone and coach gets indirect. my comments were directed more at his play. Frankly, usually when a player doesn't check in and comes on during live ball its a screwup and not related to unsportsmanlike issues. that's where i was focused.

Welpe, what do you mean by the "where they come from" portion? thx

[Welpe]

Unsportsmanlike conduct isn't the only reason I'd stick a player as bench personnel. If he comes off the bench and "hot swaps" as play is live, I think there's an argument to make for making it an indirect to the HC also.

The penalty under 10-3 says that it is penalized if discovered before the ball becomes live. That tells me that fouls under 10-3 are intended to be applied only during dead ball situations when the substitute does not follow proper procedure.