Delayed Dead Ball play

[Rich]

They do in my games, Mark. They do in many other umpires' games, too.

[jpgc99]

It seems to me that the NFHS baseball rules are arbitrarily different for almost no reason from higher codes. Furthermore, they are often deficient and lacking in depth and interpretation.

In football and basketball, this is not the case (at least to this extent). There are clear rules differences between NCAA and Fed in both football and basketball, and most can be explained. I don't agree with all the explanations (for example, Fed football wants to minimize exceptions so their penalty enforcement is much simpler than NCAA). In baseball, the fed rules (and fed mechanics) simply appear to be sub-par for no reason.

Therefore, most umpires at the high school level use CCA 2-man mechanics and rely on supplemental rules explanations from MLB, NCAA, etc.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

My original ruling in my OP was slightly correct because there were two outs at the start of the play. I went back to my OP and edited it, by adding a P.S. with the correct ruling.

Corrected Ruling.: R1 is out on appeal for missing 3B; R2's run does not score because R1's baserunning infraction is the third out of the inning; and B5's at bat is a fielder's choice (if you are scoring at home, ).

MTD, Sr.


P.S.: NFHS R8-S2-A6k and R9-S1-A1, Exception c or d (my preference is c but d applies equally).

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by umpjim

And what do you think that opinion would be?

UmpJim:

I don't know because I have not yet finished composing the email to the OhioHSAA Director of Officiating--Baseball who will know doubt make a preliminary ruling and forward it on to the NFHS Baseball Rules Editor in Indianapolis for an final ruling.

MTD, Sr.

Originally Posted by Rich

They do in my games, Mark. They do in many other umpires' games, too.

Rich:

Here in the great State of Ohio, OhioHSAA baseball umpires follow NFHS Baseball Rules. An umpire who intentionally fails to follow NFHS Rules and Intepretations by applying rules interpretations from other codes will soon find himself not umpiring, and losing tournament assignments.

MTD, Sr.

Originally Posted by jpgc99

It seems to me that the NFHS baseball rules are arbitrarily different for almost no reason from higher codes. Furthermore, they are often deficient and lacking in depth and interpretation.

In football and basketball, this is not the case (at least to this extent). There are clear rules differences between NCAA and Fed in both football and basketball, and most can be explained. I don't agree with all the explanations (for example, Fed football wants to minimize exceptions so their penalty enforcement is much simpler than NCAA). In baseball, the fed rules (and fed mechanics) simply appear to be sub-par for no reason.

Therefore, most umpires at the high school level use CCA 2-man mechanics and rely on supplemental rules explanations from MLB, NCAA, etc.

jpgc99:

As I said to Rich above, failure to follow NFHS Baseball Rules, Interpretations, and Mechanics can definitely lose an umpire games and tournament assignments. The umpires in almost all first and second round tournament games are evaluated, and the umpires in all Sweet 16 Games and beyond are evaluated. Applying NCAA or OBR rules, interpretations, or mechanics in an OhioHSAA baseball games especially in tournament play will get you in trouble.

MTD, Sr.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

UmpJim:

I don't know because I have not yet finished composing the email to the OhioHSAA Director of Officiating--Baseball who will know doubt make a preliminary ruling and forward it on to the NFHS Baseball Rules Editor in Indianapolis for
MTD, Sr.

The last time somebody asked FED for an interp based on a contentious issue in a forum regarding projected subs it was reported that no interp was required.
What if they tell you that no interp is required because everyone umpiring baseball knows that a missed base caused by obstruction should not be ruled a missed base?

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

UmpJim:
As I said to Rich above, failure to follow NFHS Baseball Rules, Interpretations, and Mechanics can definitely lose an umpire games and tournament assignments. The umpires in almost all first and second round tournament games are evaluated, and the umpires in all Sweet 16 Games and beyond are evaluated. Applying NCAA or OBR rules, interpretations, or mechanics in an OhioHSAA baseball games especially in tournament play will get you in trouble.

If there is no interpretation, then this is the only way to go. Otherwise you'd have every man for himself and MSU as things went along. No one is losing games of any importance in Ohio or anywhere else by using OBR to fill gaps where FED has not done their job.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Matt

If there is no interpretation, then this is the only way to go. Otherwise you'd have every man for himself and MSU as things went along. No one is losing games of any importance in Ohio or anywhere else by using OBR to fill gaps where FED has not done their job.

I'd tell a coach that the obstruction caused the missed base and we'd go back to playing ball and EVERYONE would forget about the call.

The rules and case book have holes you can drive a truck through. It's one reason I carry the BRD to every game I work. Not that I'd pull it out on the field, but I've found myself looking stuff up before and after games many times over the years.

[jpgc99]

Originally Posted by Rich

I'd tell a coach that the obstruction caused the missed base and we'd go back to playing ball and EVERYONE would forget about the call.

The rules and case book have holes you can drive a truck through. It's one reason I carry the BRD to every game I work. Not that I'd pull it out on the field, but I've found myself looking stuff up before and after games many times over the years.

Exactly. As I said above, baseball FED rules have many, many gaps. It is impossible to use only that material to umpire a game. Most umpires have no choice but to supplement their rules knowledge with materials from other sources. Ohio might not like it, but this is the reality.

[DG]

When I encounter a FED situation that does not seem to be covered by rule or case book, but I know is covered by MLB interpretation, I apply the MLB interpretation, as I would in this case. There are many rules that are not be interpreted literally, but with the intent the rule exists.