This Just Seemed Odd...from rule aficionado/lurker

[kylejt]

LL minors is the learning division. Learning for coaches, managers, players, umpires, scorekeepers, Division Reps, and parents. Everyone is getting smarter, I like to say (as opposed to most everyone is clueless).

Pick the hill you want to die on, down there. There are times you may be right, but a what cost? You might get the call overturned, but lose a lot of "friends" along the way. Next year, when the president is picking managers, how do you want to be remembered?

When calls don't fall your way, that's a real teachable moment for everyone. And no doubt, there are times to question, and times to protest. Just be very selective.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by MD Longhorn

I agree with your result but not your reasoning. The umpire crossed the line when he told the defense what to do. HE put the offense in jeopardy. He must rectify that. If the ball is going to remain live, he cannot influence play by telling the defense not to leave the field.

(And heck, he also put the defense in jeopardy by telling the offense it was still live - had events after him butting in evolved differently, his announcement to each team what they should do during a live ball could have aided the offense instead...)

Once he told EITHER team what to do during a live ball, he has to kill it. At ANY level.

I didn't read in the OP that the umpire told the defense what to do. To me, what he did is no different than when an umpire says, "That's only two outs!" while teams are erroneously changing sides. Or are you suggesting we shouldn't say anything in those situations?

Now, this being a preseason game, which the OP didn't mention until a subsequent post, yeah it should be rectified. But for a regular season game involving two competitive teams, I still believe the base coach should be responsible for not knowing the rules.

[Robert Goodman]

This seems to be a FAQ here that transcends the type of sport being officiated. Several times in different sections someone has raised the question of what happens when opposing competitors each misconceive the situation and an official is not quick to rectify it or prevent error, or the competitors don't grasp what the official is signaling.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Manny A

when an umpire says, "That's only two outs!" while teams are erroneously changing sides. Or are you suggesting we shouldn't say anything in those situations?

Yes. At least not if there's a possibility of action happening.

[DG]

Last pre-season game and coach gets pretty upset? Really?

Put everything back to where it was immediately prior to the misunderstanding and tell the coach to calm down or sit down.

[CVLLBlue]

[QUOTE=More Cowbell;926817]It's been a few years but I still love this site, and I come with a question.

AAA Little League (10-11 year olds), 5th run in the inning scores as trail runner reaches third base. Everyone on both teams starts to run in towards the dugouts thinking the "5 Run Max" rule was in effect, not realizing in the last two innings you can bat the lineup. Coaches were out of dugouts trying to get players attention and send them back out.

Umpire (one man crew) runs down third base line and does a "circly" motion with his hand which looked like it was a "change sides" motion--sort of like a home run signal. He said he was verbalizing (and motioning) to both sides that we needed to bat the lineup. After the instruction from the ump, the defense threw to third and tagged out the runner who had started toward his dugout.


So...does his communication to the teams constitute "time out?" It was clear that both teams thought one rule was in effect when in fact it wasn't. It was pretty chaotic with players, parents, and coaches yelling, "We are still batting, get back out there" or "We are still on the field, get out there."

The actual 5 run rule for Little League is that the inning ends with 3 outs or 5 runs scored, whichever comes first. Only in the 6th inning can more runs be scored. If a time limit shortens the game, there is no "unlimited run inning" unless it is the 6th inning. There are no local rules that can change this.

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CVLLBlue

The actual 5 run rule for Little League is that the inning ends with 3 outs or 5 runs scored, whichever comes first. Only in the 6th inning can more runs be scored.

But it is still limited, by LL rule 5.07. The rule states that an inning ends when 5 runs are scored OR when the team bats the roster. The 5-run limit goes away in the last inning if the BOD exercises the option in the rule, but the roster limit does not.

Originally Posted by CVLLBlue

If a time limit shortens the game, there is no "unlimited run inning" unless it is the 6th inning.

I disagree. The option in rule 5.07 to do away with the 5-run limit says, with my emphasis, "The local league board of directors may suspend the five-run rule in the LAST half-inning for either team." It doesn't say in the 6th inning. So, IMO, if the local BOD decides to exercise this option, it goes into effect whenver the umpire declares a final inning, whether it be due to time limits or other game-shortenening situation.