Little League World Series Umps

[Forest Ump]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

Puerto Rico vs. Australia....PU...OMG.

Wow, just wow! The crazy man strike call and the Eric Gregg zone. This game is going to be funnnnnn....he's very quick too.

I saw that too, Bob. He rung up some kid with a turn to his right and just held his arm out there for like 5 seconds. Pretty bad. Apparently he didn't learn how to indicate a foul tip either.

Now with all that has been said about LL umpires, we had a guy from our college group work the plate at the LL world series last year. He didn't fit the mold of these other guys we have seen on TV. He was pretty damn good.

[RPatrino]

Steve, the exceptions are few and far between. So far, I have only seen one PU that called a great game. The base and line umps have been marginal at best. I hope that they whittle the crews down to the best for the final rounds of the series. This is a showcase event for LL and they should be showcasing the best of the best in their umpire world. They clearly aren't or they clearly don't know how to define excellence in umpiring.

[UMP45]

No LL simply doesn't care whether the umpires are good or not. Remember they have Instant Replay!

[PeteBooth]

You cannot have it both ways.

LL is supposed to be about Volunteering. If you were ever a UIC or a scheduler of umpires for a given LL season, you have your guys / gals that you can count on. They might not necessarily be the best but they are willing and able.

Then you get to the districts / sates etc. etc. and then the Distric administrator gets involved and brings in their "heavy-weights"

The "other group" who busts their buts all year round gets nothing or at the very least maybe a couple of first / second round All Star games at best.

Then we wonder why ABC LL organization can't get umpires. Hey it's ok for me to work games all week maybe 3-4 games on Saturday but when the "big" games come I am not good enough.

You said it best "we had a guy from our college group"

This guy should be polished.

I am not saying this college umpire did not donate games for free to LL but if he was doing college ball he was not there each and every night.

Also, LLWS umpire bashing has been going on for quite some time now. In a Forum I used to visit quite frequently (eteamz) it was a yearly event.

The problem: LL "sold their sole" to the network

Instead of LL doing the right thing and pay for umpires, they want to "hide" behind the notion that it's all Volunteer but when the "show" starts they want the cream of the crop umpires. I too knew some college guys that umpired at the districts etc. Yeah they were good but they should have been.

In a nutshell you "cannot have your cake and eat it to" If it's truly volunteer then allow the guys / gals who bust their butts all year to officiate, otherwise simply pay for the officials.

Pete Booth

[Rich]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

You cannot have it both ways.

LL is supposed to be about Volunteering. If you were ever a UIC or a scheduler of umpires for a given LL season, you have your guys / gals that you can count on. They might not necessarily be the best but they are willing and able.

Then you get to the districts / sates etc. etc. and then the Distric administrator gets involved and brings in their "heavy-weights"

The "other group" who busts their buts all year round gets nothing or at the very least maybe a couple of first / second round All Star games at best.

Then we wonder why ABC LL organization can't get umpires. Hey it's ok for me to work games all week maybe 3-4 games on Saturday but when the "big" games come I am not good enough.

You said it best "we had a guy from our college group"

This guy should be polished.

I am not saying this college umpire did not donate games for free to LL but if he was doing college ball he was not there each and every night.

Also, LLWS umpire bashing has been going on for quite some time now. In a Forum I used to visit quite frequently (eteamz) it was a yearly event.

The problem: LL "sold their sole" to the network

Instead of LL doing the right thing and pay for umpires, they want to "hide" behind the notion that it's all Volunteer but when the "show" starts they want the cream of the crop umpires. I too knew some college guys that umpired at the districts etc. Yeah they were good but they should have been.

In a nutshell you "cannot have your cake and eat it to" If it's truly volunteer then allow the guys / gals who bust their butts all year to officiate, otherwise simply pay for the officials.

Pete Booth

Pete, your post is full of crap, in 2 ways.

(1) I give away over a month of prime money games every year to volunteer during the LL tournaments. I should be thought of as no less a volunteer because I work college baseball in the spring than these umpires are. In the end, we all meet the LL criteria for post-season assignments.

(2) Cream of the crop? Have you been watching the LLWS this year?

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE][QUOTE]

Originally Posted by Rich

Pete, your post is full of crap, in 2 ways.

(1) I give away over a month of prime money games every year to volunteer during the LL tournaments. I should be thought of as no less a volunteer because I work college baseball in the spring than these umpires are. In the end, we all meet the LL criteria for post-season assignments.

Rich you made my point by saying during the LL tournaments That was my point.

What about the regular season? You come in during the tournaments which I also do, but if I was one of those regular season umpires and did not get any Tournament games because you and other college / FED umpires wanted them I would not like it and I do not think you would either.

My main point is this

It's LL and it should be umpired by the people who officiate day in and day out no matter how bad / good BUT LL has sold out to TV.

Also, here most are bashing the LLWS umps

We had a PRO umpire this year allow a pitching change without the original F1 throwing a pitch a basic rule.

Pete Booth

[Rich]

[QUOTE=PeteBooth;902878][QUOTE]

Rich you made my point by saying during the LL tournaments That was my point.

What about the regular season? You come in during the tournaments which I also do, but if I was one of those regular season umpires and did not get any Tournament games because you and other college / FED umpires wanted them I would not like it and I do not think you would either.

My main point is this

It's LL and it should be umpired by the people who officiate day in and day out no matter how bad / good BUT LL has sold out to TV.

Also, here most are bashing the LLWS umps

We had a PRO umpire this year allow a pitching change without the original F1 throwing a pitch a basic rule.

Pete Booth

The local leagues pay their umpires during the season. Mostly teenagers.

[briancurtin]

Originally Posted by Rich

The local leagues pay their umpires during the season. Mostly teenagers.

This is how I got my start, for whatever it's worth. I was making $20 on the bases, $25 on the plate, for a $45 DH. Sometimes I'd just do two plates if the other kid didn't want to suit up.

When tournament time came, any of us who had our head halfway screwed on and saved enough of that cash to call up +POS and order a shirt and pants would sometimes work the District tourneys as volunteers. Here and there one of us would make it to Sectionals (or whatever's after District). I think this was partly because we had a few full-time volunteers who were trusted and able to vouch for us.

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by briancurtin

This is how I got my start, for whatever it's worth. I was making $20 on the bases, $25 on the plate, for a $45 DH. Sometimes I'd just do two plates if the other kid didn't want to suit up.

When tournament time came, any of us who had our head halfway screwed on and saved enough of that cash to call up +POS and order a shirt and pants would sometimes work the District tourneys as volunteers. Here and there one of us would make it to Sectionals (or whatever's after District). I think this was partly because we had a few full-time volunteers who were trusted and able to vouch for us.

This is almost exactly how I got my start. Calling Little League for cash was a great gig as a teenager and beat the pants off of working a real job. We had a pretty good cadre of adult and older high school umps that helped bring us along. We always sent several to at least Districts each year though it never occurred to me to try and make it above that.

[Multiple Sports]

[QUOTE=PeteBooth;902878][QUOTE]

Rich you made my point by saying during the LL tournaments That was my point.

What about the regular season? You come in during the tournaments which I also do, but if I was one of those regular season umpires and did not get any Tournament games because you and other college / FED umpires wanted them I would not like it and I do not think you would either.

My main point is this

It's LL and it should be umpired by the people who officiate day in and day out no matter how bad / good BUT LL has sold out to TV.

Also, here most are bashing the LLWS umps

We had a PRO umpire this year allow a pitching change without the original F1 throwing a pitch a basic rule.

Pete Booth

Pete -

I totally disagree with your opinion. If supervisors at any level can get someone whom they feel is better the so be it.....

It happens at every level...

For example, your from NY so I will use this example. The guy that assigns the MAAC Conference for basketball uses three guys that work a lot of Big East games to work the final and those guys dont work a lotta of MAAC games during the season, but they are better than most of the other guys and maybe the supervisor trusts them.

You have only said that becasue you work all season long, that you are entitled to those games (playoffs). Don't the kids deserve the best officiating the league can get them regardless.

More often than not, those guys supervisors are bringing in are just more talented and sometimes as officials we need to accept that they may be better.....

Assigners face the challenge of availabilty vs. ability. AS someone who has assigned at the hs level for 15 yrs, I'll take ability all the time. And to the umpires who are honest with themselves they will admit that more often than not they aren't working a certain game because I have chosen someone better,,,,,

[PeteBooth]

[QUOTE][QUOTE=Multiple Sports;902937][QUOTE=PeteBooth;902878]

Pete -

I totally disagree with your opinion. If supervisors at any level can get someone whom they feel is better the so be it.....

It happens at every level...

For example, your from NY so I will use this example. The guy that assigns the MAAC Conference for basketball uses three guys that work a lot of Big East games to work the final and those guys dont work a lotta of MAAC games during the season, but they are better than most of the other guys and maybe the supervisor trusts them.




You have only said that becasue you work all season long, that you are entitled to those games (playoffs). Don't the kids deserve the best officiating the league can get them regardless.

Disagreeing is all part of the Internet Umpire Doscussion Forum setting. If we all agreed it would be boring.

IMO, you are comparing Apples / Oranges

In the example you gave College officiating is a paid job and that's the way it's done. Same in HS once you get to the sectional / state level. You are chosen because of ratings.

LL is a Volunteer Organization and is different. It's ok to use "so and so" during the reg season but because the "stakes" are now higher we don't need them anymore?

What message are you sending? In the example you gave there is a plethora of officials waiting for their chance.

During a regular season LL game, try and find umpires. I was once one of those "parents from the stands umpires" , enjoyed it and took it a step further.

IMO, cannot compare college or even HS officiating to a volunteer organization. Like I said can't have it both ways.

Pete Booth

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

Like I said can't have it both ways.

Pete Booth

Except that LL insists on trying to do exactly that.

Like I said before, you get what you pay for. If you disagree, watch another game on TV until you agree. It's a mess. If you don't see the mess, you have put your blinders on and refuse to see.

[Multiple Sports]

[QUOTE=PeteBooth;902943][QUOTE][QUOTE=Multiple Sports;902937]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

Disagreeing is all part of the Internet Umpire Doscussion Forum setting. If we all agreed it would be boring.

IMO, you are comparing Apples / Oranges

In the example you gave College officiating is a paid job and that's the way it's done. Same in HS once you get to the sectional / state level. You are chosen because of ratings.

LL is a Volunteer Organization and is different. It's ok to use "so and so" during the reg season but because the "stakes" are now higher we don't need them anymore?

What message are you sending? In the example you gave there is a plethora of officials waiting for their chance.

During a regular season LL game, try and find umpires. I was once one of those "parents from the stands umpires" , enjoyed it and took it a step further.

IMO, cannot compare college or even HS officiating to a volunteer organization. Like I said can't have it both ways.

Pete Booth

Pete -

You are right, Being it is LL, the comparison may be a bit different. But ultimately, if I am responsible for umpires and you "volunteered" 20 dates
and someone else with 6 state championships under their belt is available and
has met LL qualifications and worked 1 game, I am taking him. If you don't like that, then you have to become a better umpire.

To be completely honest, I see a real trend in officiating today, where guys
are stepping out on the field or court poorly trained or not trained at all and are either in it for the money or are volunteering and then when "better" blues come along they are upset that they are getting pushed to the side.

Ultimately you are responsible for your own schedule........have you done everything you can do to ensure a good schedule.

Are you in the best shape / Is your uniform dry cleaned / do you know rules inside and out / do you have the best people skills (game management) / do you turn back game during the season.. All the above affecct your schedule in ways you have no idea....

Hope I didn't go off on a tangent, but nobody is owed anything in officiating.....