An interesting force out/obstruction

[Matt]

Originally Posted by Mountaincoach

Yes I agree the obstruction would have negated the rest of the play if it happened before the base tag. But it pretty much happened simultaneously, so the umpire made a judgement call and called the force out at third.

Coincidentally, I just had a guy walk into my workplace who's been a little league umpire for about 10 years. I mentioned the play to him and he brought up another point that I'm not so sure about. In the play, both F5 and F6 charged the ball. After F5 beat F6 to the ball, F6 ran back toward his playing area and collided with my runner. The guy I just talked to said that was NOT obstruction BECAUSE F6 could have theoretically been trying to make a play at second considering R1 was coming to second (even though F5 was making an unassisted play at third at the time with the ball in his glove). I'm not so sure about that.....

...with good reason. He's wrong.

On a batted ball, there is no more than one protected fielder--the fielder who, in the umpire's judgment, has the best chance of fielding the ball at the time. Any impeding of a runner by any other fielder is obstruction. Any impeding of the protected fielder is interference.

Once the ball is fielded, it is no longer a batted ball. Any impeding of a runner by any fielder without the ball is obstruction, unless (assuming OBR) the fielder is in the act of catching a thrown ball when a play is imminent. For this type of impediment to be legal, the act that impedes the runner must be a part of the necessary action of the fielder to make the play. Under FED, there is no imminent play allowance--the fielder must allow some access to the base unless he has possession of the ball.

[Mountaincoach]

Originally Posted by Matt

...with good reason. He's wrong.

On a batted ball, there is no more than one protected fielder--the fielder who, in the umpire's judgment, has the best chance of fielding the ball at the time. Any impeding of a runner by any other fielder is obstruction. Any impeding of the protected fielder is interference.

Once the ball is fielded, it is no longer a batted ball. Any impeding of a runner by any fielder without the ball is obstruction, unless (assuming OBR) the fielder is in the act of catching a thrown ball when a play is imminent. For this type of impediment to be legal, the act that impedes the runner must be a part of the necessary action of the fielder to make the play. Under FED, there is no imminent play allowance--the fielder must allow some access to the base unless he has possession of the ball.

Thanks! He's a long-time friend of mine, and I can't wait to tell him.

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by Mountaincoach

Thanks! He's a long-time friend of mine, and I can't wait to tell him.

Yeah, baby. Gettin' lucky in Kentucky!

[RPatrino]

You don't ignore the obstruction, you either enforce or not enforce the penalty.

[Mountaincoach]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

You don't ignore the obstruction, you either enforce or not enforce the penalty.

But how do you enforce it in that situation? Does it overrule the force out at third regardless of whether or not the third baseman tagged the bag before, at the same time, or after the obstruction occurred?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Mountaincoach

But how do you enforce it in that situation? Does it overrule the force out at third regardless of whether or not the third baseman tagged the bag before, at the same time, or after the obstruction occurred?

If the runner was obstructed before that runner was out, you enforce the obstruction, even if it's almost definite that the runner would have been out. In your sitch, if the OBS was first, runner gets 3rd.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by RPatrino

You don't ignore the obstruction, you either enforce or not enforce the penalty.

I wouldn't put it this way. This issue is whether the hindrance occurred before the runner was out. If before, then it's OBS. If not, then not.

If you rule obstruction, you must enforce the penalty.

[Rich Ives]

R2 was header to 3B. The play was made at 3B. The play was thus made on R2. R2 was obsrtructed. Type A. Automatic minimum one base award. R2 gets 3B. There's no woulda-shoulda about Type A.

In FED it's ALWAYS a minimum one base.

Convince me I'm wrong.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Rich Ives

R2 was header to 3B. The play was made at 3B. The play was thus made on R2. R2 was obsrtructed. Type A. Automatic minimum one base award. R2 gets 3B. There's no woulda-shoulda about Type A.

In FED it's ALWAYS a minimum one base.

Convince me I'm wrong.

If you're talking to me, my point is that it's impossible to hinder a retired runner.