Bob Davidson

[BaBa Booey]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Then (to me) worse - echoing a partner's call when he couldn't possibly have seen the call in question.

So if your partner calls a balk in a game and you don't see it, you're not going to echo it?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by BaBa Booey

So if your partner calls a balk in a game and you don't see it, you're not going to echo it?

Some places / mechanics teach to echo, some don't.

And, I think either way, there's a difference between "I was watching but didn't see what my partner saw" and "I had my head up my *** and the only balk I could have seen was a colon spasm caused by the burrito I had at lunch."

[BaBa Booey]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Some places / mechanics teach to echo, some don't.

And, I think either way, there's a difference between "I was watching but didn't see what my partner saw" and "I had my head up my *** and the only balk I could have seen was a colon spasm caused by the burrito I had at lunch."

Yes there is a difference in WHY the balk wasn't seen, but in professional baseball (at least in the minors, anyway) we were taught to echo the balk call, regardless.

And only Bob knows what Bob was doing, but if any of you out there are telling yourselves that you've never looked away momentarily during a live ball situation, you're flat out lying. Everyone has done it. Bob got lucky that this didn't blow up in his face (even though it still looks to me like his head is turned towards the infield)

[Rich]

Who cares? *Every*one looks away from the pitcher for a second. They have 4 umpires, for crying out loud and it only takes one. Hell, in 2-man I'd be hard pressed to say I am looking at the pitcher every split second that he has the ball.

It also looks to me like Bob is merely directing the runner home, not echoing the balk. Of course, that isn't a good enough explanation for those who dislike Balk-a-Day Bob or are looking for any reason to rag on MLB umpires.

[BaBa Booey]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

Who cares? *Every*one looks away from the pitcher for a second. They have 4 umpires, for crying out loud and it only takes one. Hell, in 2-man I'd be hard pressed to say I am looking at the pitcher every split second that he has the ball.

It also looks to me like Bob is merely directing the runner home, not echoing the balk. Of course, that isn't a good enough explanation for those who dislike Balk-a-Day Bob or are looking for any reason to rag on MLB umpires.

Well said Rich.

[yawetag]

Originally Posted by BaBa Booey

And only Bob knows what Bob was doing, but if any of you out there are telling yourselves that you've never looked away momentarily during a live ball situation, you're flat out lying. Everyone has done it.

This.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by BaBa Booey

So if your partner calls a balk in a game and you don't see it, you're not going to echo it?

No. And if I saw it but someone else called it first ... still no.

[BaBa Booey]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

No.

So if the coach comes out to you because you're closer, you're going to tell him what? I didn't see it? Go ask my partner, he's the one who called it? In other words, "Either I wasn;t paying attention or my partner saw a non-existant balk"

Can't see that going over too well...

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by BaBa Booey

So if the coach comes out to you because you're closer, you're going to tell him what? I didn't see it? Go ask my partner, he's the one who called it? In other words, "Either I wasn;t paying attention or my partner saw a non-existant balk"

Can't see that going over too well...

Are you an umpire?

If my partner makes a call and the coach comes out to me, YES, I'm telling him to go ask my partner. Because that's what umpires are supposed to do. No way in HELLO am I going to discuss my partner's call with the coach. My PARTNER can come discuss it with me. Coach sure as heck can't.

That's true at every level. I see you imply above that you've umpired "professional" ball. If you have, then you already know this. If you discuss your partner's calls with coaches, you have no business doing 8U, much less pro ball.

[JJ]

If I echo a balk call that I didn't see, and the coach comes to me to explain, what will I tell him?
If I see the balk but my partner beats me to the call, I echo it. If I don't see it, I don't echo it.

JJ

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by JJ

If I echo a balk call that I didn't see, and the coach comes to me to explain, what will I tell him?
If I see the balk but my partner beats me to the call, I echo it. If I don't see it, I don't echo it.

JJ

I've heard other umpires in my assoc say the same thing. I always ask them ... so if you echo calls that you see and agree with, but don't echo if you see the situation but don't agree with ... aren't you tipping off the other team that at least one of the umpires disagreed with the initial call?

To my mind, and as I've been trained, in baseball, softball, and football - echoing is almost ALWAYS a bad thing. The only things that should be echoed are things that stop play (dead ball, foul ball, a whistle in football - and even there there's not 100% agreement, etc) and even then, you're only echoing the fact that the ball is dead, not the call itself.

[JJ]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

I've heard other umpires in my assoc say the same thing. I always ask them ... so if you echo calls that you see and agree with, but don't echo if you see the situation but don't agree with ... aren't you tipping off the other team that at least one of the umpires disagreed with the initial call?

Reread my OP. I didn't say I DISAGREED with my partner's call - I said I won't echo the call if I didn't SEE the balk. I have worked with partners who have called balks, and after the game we've discussed it, and I may have disagreed with his call, but that's not why I didn't echo it. Obviously, if I don't see what he sees I'm not calling the balk. Or echoing it.
And some coaches will ALWAYS use the line "Your partner didn't call it - HE didn't think it was a balk." As with all baseball comments, I consider the source.

JJ

[BaBa Booey]

A balk is not the same as a force play at first. A balk is supposed to be seen by everyone and called by everyone, which is why they teach you to echo the call. Strength in numbers. None of this "I'll take no-stops and double sets, you take knee-buckles, etc" nonsense. If you don't echo it, it looks like you didn't see it, which makes the manager think "what the hell did that other guy see??" You echo it, and then your partner is supposed to either intercept the manager coming out or just answer the question before it is asked by yelling out "He didn't stop, Mike!" or whatever the case may be. You cover him, he covers you.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by BaBa Booey

your partner is supposed to either intercept the manager coming out or just answer the question before it is asked by yelling out "He didn't stop, Mike!"

Ah ... thanks. Now I KNOW you aren't an umpire. When I see an umpire yelling across the field at someone, I know they really have no idea what they are doing. Who is this "THEY" that is teaching you such nonsense?

I'm done.

[BaBa Booey]

You can think what you want. Anyone who has been to PBUC, the Evans 5 week school or any of Jim's clinics has been taught this very procedure.