Retired B/R continues to 2B

[jicecone]

Luckily, you didn't have to toss the HC because you were'nt sure you knew what your talking about.

At times like this , I tend to make a mental note of the situation and as soon as I get back to the car look it up in my books.

Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice , shame on them.

But the good point here is that you learned two things:

1.The correct ruling.
2.How not to handle a situation like this.

[scarolinablue]

Originally Posted by jicecone

Luckily, you didn't have to toss the HC because you were'nt sure you knew what your talking about.

At times like this , I tend to make a mental note of the situation and as soon as I get back to the car look it up in my books.

Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice , shame on them.

But the good point here is that you learned two things:

1.The correct ruling.
2.How not to handle a situation like this.

I did try to look it up that night (this was Tuesday night), and couldn't find anything specifically illegal, so I started to realize I was wrong. Honestly, I'd never encountered this in now my 8th year of HS ball, and it just didn't look right to me. Now I know better, and I'm glad I didn't grab an out or worse in the sitch. I'll likely say something to the coach the next time as well, as he's one of the good ones. I just came here for some assistance in my search. I'm glad some choose to help, and others choose to "help" but can't help themselves.

I still haven't located a specific interp - or is this just one of those cases where if it's not in the book, then it's not illegal? If you have the reference, please share. Thanks. I accept that I (almost) blew this one big time.

[scarolinablue]

Found the OBR reference:

Rule 7.09(e) Comment: If the batter or a runner continues to advance after he has been put out, he shall not by that act alone be considered as confusing, hindering or impeding the fielders.

Can't find the corresponding FED reference. I get it, as long as there is no intentional interfering action by the retired runner, it's nothing. I suppose the fact it just looked wrong tripped me up. Won't make THAT mistake again.

[UmpJM]

scarolinablue,

See FED Case Play 8.3.3i.

JM

[pastordoug]

If my memory serves me correctly, there was a rather lengthy post on this exact subject recently.... I will try and find it....

Well put jicecone. Every game has an opportunity to learn.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by jicecone

Fool me once, shame on me. Fool me twice , shame on them.

Perhaps you're thinking of this old saying:

Fool me once, shame on you; fool me twice, shame on me.

[Kevin Finnerty]

Fool me once ... shame on ... shame on you. Fool me ... you can't get fooled again!

[JR12]

Originally Posted by Kevin Finnerty

Fool me once ... shame on ... shame on you. Fool me ... you can't get fooled again!

lol Kevin. Thats a qoute by our former president who often goofed up the English language.

[BretMan]

And, please, for the sake of the game, don't trot out the old "travesty of the game" argument anytime you see something on a baseball field that "just doesn't look right"!

In OBR, the odd phrase about "making a travesty of the game" appears in conjunction with one rule- the rule about a runner running the bases in reverse order. In FED it appears twice- once in the same rule about running the bases in reverse order and again in reference to making (guessing at) multiple appeals.

Those are the only times this phrase appears and those are the only situations where an umpire should make any sort of ruling based on "making a travesty of the game". Yet, time and time again, I see umpires trying to apply some imaginary "travesty rule" whenever they see something unusual, out of the ordinary or just plain different happen in one of their games.

"Making a travesty of the game" is an archaic sort of term, but it probably sounded right when this rule was first crafted in the early 1900's. The rule was first put in place to address the then-common practice of a baserunner already on second base "stealing" first base, hoping to draw a throw or confuse the defense enough to allow a runner on third the chance to score. Having a runner advance "the wrong way" was deemed counterproductive to the goals of the sport- indeed, even a travesty!- and this practice was outlawed. The interpretation was subsequently expanded to include a player who runs the bases "clockwise"- from home to third to second to first.

The so-called "travesty rule" isn't some blanket ruling that can be applied to any situation under the sun that looks odd or different to an umpire. It applies to one very specific rule infraction (in OBR, two in FED) that most of us will probably never see in one of our games.

[scarolinablue]

Thanks, UmpJM. That's the interp I needed.

And no, I didn't actually use the term "travesty of the game" with the OC, though I made it sound that way in my OP. It was more of the deliberate attempt to deceive.

Can't believe I brain-farted so badly on this one. Thanks for the proper admonishing and help. Lesson: don't make a rule where one doesn't exist...if it's not in the book, it must not be illegal.

I suppose I need to read my own signature line...

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by scarolinablue

Thanks, UmpJM. That's the interp I needed.

And no, I didn't actually use the term "travesty of the game" with the OC, though I made it sound that way in my OP. It was more of the deliberate attempt to deceive.

Can't believe I brain-farted so badly on this one. Thanks for the proper admonishing and help. Lesson: don't make a rule where one doesn't exist...if it's not in the book, it must not be illegal.

I suppose I need to read my own signature line...

Good idea (read your own signature line)

Now, go get a beer and sit in the corner and contemplate what you did wrong. Consume as much beer as it takes to either understand your mistake or fall over.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

Good idea (read your own signature line)

Now, go get a beer and sit in the corner and contemplate what you did wrong. Consume as much beer as it takes to either understand your mistake or fall over.

Mmmmm, beer. What were we talking about again?

[Steven Tyler]

Originally Posted by scarolinablue

Thanks, UmpJM. That's the interp I needed.

And no, I didn't actually use the term "travesty of the game" with the OC, though I made it sound that way in my OP. It was more of the deliberate attempt to deceive.

Can't believe I brain-farted so badly on this one. Thanks for the proper admonishing and help. Lesson: don't make a rule where one doesn't exist...if it's not in the book, it must not be illegal.

I suppose I need to read my own signature line...

Look at it this way. If the ball is caught or dropped, you're still getting an out regardless. Sounds like a win win situation to me.

[dash_riprock]

Originally Posted by BretMan

And, please, for the sake of the game, don't trot out the old "travesty of the game" argument anytime you see something on a baseball field that "just doesn't look right"!

In other words, don't make a travesty of the game by trotting out the old "travesty of the game" argument.

[scarolinablue]

Originally Posted by dash_riprock

In other words, don't make a travesty of the game by trotting out the old "travesty of the game" argument.

Ding ding ding, we have a winner!

Mmmmmmm, beer...think I'll have a few tonight (after my game, of course)...I'm thinking Franziskaner on tap.