What is the outcome of this?

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

but it's an appeal play, not a force play right?

It's both. But you'd only need the force play if it were the third out.

[johnnyg08]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

johnny,

You seem to suggest these are mutually exclusive options - they are not. See post #5 above.

JM

Just like the LAD/D-Backs game right...if Pierre doesn't get in the rundown, they don't have the 4th out option right?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

but it's an appeal play, not a force play right?

It might be both (depending on what specific play you are discussing).

An out can be made either "during regular action" or "on appeal".

An out can be a force out or a non-force out.

You can get either / any by touching the bag or tagging the runner.

[Paul L]

Originally Posted by johnnyg08

Just like the LAD/D-Backs game right...if Pierre doesn't get in the rundown, they don't have the 4th out option right?

Not precisely true. If the appeal, whether tagging the runner or tagging the base, occurs before the run crosses the plate, then there would be no need for the fourth out option. I saw some fan comments that suggested it was the body tag rather than the "force-out" base tag that made the difference, which is wrong, of course.
Pierre did not get into a rundown. Both F4 Lopez and R2 Pierre were walking toward each other while R3 Ethier was sprinting across the plate. That's what made that play possible. DMF4.

[cc6]

Originally Posted by UmpJM (nee CoachJM)

Husker,

No, that statement is not correct.

If there were 2 outs at the start of the play, then the appeal of the R1's failure to touch 2B would be a run-nullifying "advantageous apparent 4th out appeal", and no runs would score. Since the R1 was "forced" to 2B at the time of the miss, a proper appeal of his miss is treated as a force out. Since it would be the 3rd out of the half-inning, no runs would score on the play.

JM

Correct. These are the helpful posts from JM I like to see.

[bossman72]

Let's change the OP and say the BR was tagged out instead of R1, then the D appeals R1's miss of 2nd base.

Now we have 3 outs with no runs scoring, correct?

[UmpJM]

bossman,

That's correct.

As long as the out on the play and the subsequent appeal out are on two different runners, both outs stand.

Since, in the OP the R1 was forced to 2B at the time of the miss, his out is a run-nullifying 3rd out of the half-inning.

JM

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by bossman72

Let's change the OP and say the BR was tagged out instead of R1, then the D appeals R1's miss of 2nd base.

Now we have 3 outs with no runs scoring, correct?

Does the BR being tagged remove the force on R1? Does it matter whether the BR tagged out before or after he reaches first? Does it matter whether R1 was forced at the time of the pitch or the time he missed second?

[JPaco54]

I am totally confused now in regards to the OP. We have changed the scenario several times during this post and I am still not sure what the correct answer is to the OP. Do the two runs count when there is only one out? Thanks!

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by JPaco54

I am totally confused now in regards to the OP. We have changed the scenario several times during this post and I am still not sure what the correct answer is to the OP. Do the two runs count when there is only one out? Thanks!

Yes -- 2 runs score, R1 is out at third, BR is safe at whatever base he ends up at. The appeal has no effect (since it's not an "advantageous 4th out")