Would you have dumped him?

[DG]

Originally Posted by bobbybanaduck

could i just toss my partner?

I assume you are speaking from PU perspective as your partner is the one who pooched this call...

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

This is the very problem I have with many baseball umpires. You would never be able to work basketball or football if every time someone said something to you if there was an ejection on the spot. This is not the pros. Pro players and coaches know what is coming and that is why they know what to do and say to get ejected. I really wish we would get that pro mentality out of even college to LL ball.

Peace

I am a football varsity white hat and a varsity basketball official. In Illinois as well as Wisconsin.

I would whack the kid in basketball and would throw a 15-yard USC in football.

In baseball, the player gets ejected. C'est la vie. Different sports, different punishments.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You must have an ejection every game if you do not like people yelling at you. I see more coaches in baseball yelling and screaming and acting like a maniac then basketball coaches ever do. Coaches whine more than anything. Being a wing official on a football crew would really get you all bent of shape.

Peace

I do not have baseball coaches acting like maniac in my games and I instruct my wings to not take unsportsmanlike conduct in football, even on Friday nights. My wings threw 3 USC flags this season, all on assistant coaches.

It's prep sports, for crying out loud. If coaches want to act like Earl Weaver or Jerry Glanville on the field at that level, we'll be happy to get rid of them, if needed.

[kylejt]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

You must have an ejection every game if you do not like people yelling at you. I see more coaches in baseball yelling and screaming and acting like a maniac then basketball coaches ever do. Coaches whine more than anything. Being a wing official on a football crew would really get you all bent of shape.

Peace

No. I've averaged about one EJ per season. I guess coaches just know that can't yell at me. YMMV, but I just don't allow it and let the guys know about up front.

Or maybe I'm just getting more calls right than you are

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by kylejt

That's so true. When I watch HS basketball, I can't for the life of me understand why the officials let the coaches talk to them like that. They drop "You...." in the first 30 seconds of every game. Me, I'd hike up my polyester black slacks and toss anyone who'd yell at me like that. If all hardwood officials had the balls to do so they wouldn't be in the state they're in. Although I'll be honest with you, the first time some pencilnecked basketball coach said "you're horrible" with those beet red faces they get, an ejection would be the least of his troubles. I guess that's why I'll never be a ref. Don't talk to me any differently than you would at the grocery store.

Honestly, I don't know how you guys do it.

Don't assume that all basketball officials take crap. You would be very wrong.

[Jurassic Referee]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I do not have baseball coaches acting like maniac in my games and I instruct my wings to not take unsportsmanlike conduct in football, even on Friday nights.

If the coaches know that you'll take care of bidness, they're usually smart enough to leave you alone. Usually. The ones that don't need to disappear.

They know who they can go after and who they can't. In my experience, that holds true for all sports.

[PeteBooth]

I realize we all have our own tolerance level, but how much "crap" do you put up with in your games.

Are you going to allow some snot nose kid to draw a line after you call a pitch a strike on the outside corner and he objects to it?

You can agree to disagree but how do you keep control in your games if tolerate such nonsense.

Look at the clip again. We cannot see the BU but IMO we have indistbutable eveidence that the kid turned around, looked at the BU and then through his helmet and hat in DISGUST at the call. It was not frustration.

Then we have the coach condoning this behavior by slapping his player on the back and basically saying "atta boy"

Pete Booth

[bob jenkins]

I finally got a chance to watch the video.

Ejection.

The kid (and coaches) have a right to be mad, but he (they) also have to learn the correct way to express it.

[PeteBooth]

Unfortunately baseball does not have a "team suffering" penalty as does basketball and football other then ejection.

Also, for the most part I think most organizations have an automatic one game suspension to try and clean-up the league.

If it's one of the "stud" players then the team will suffer, but if it's a marginal player then for the most part the team will not suffer.

It would be nice to get an extra out for a "personal foul" in baseball. I know us umpires wouldn't complain.

Pete Booth

[gordon30307]

Ejection. Depends. Has stuff like this been going on for the entire game? Was it frustration with the call a or frustration directed at himself. I may or may not.

[jicecone]

Originally Posted by PeteBooth

I realize we all have our own tolerance level, but how much "crap" do you put up with in your games.

Are you going to allow some snot nose kid to draw a line after you call a pitch a strike on the outside corner and he objects to it?

You can agree to disagree but how do you keep control in your games if tolerate such nonsense.

Look at the clip again. We cannot see the BU but IMO we have indistbutable eveidence that the kid turned around, looked at the BU and then through his helmet and hat in DISGUST at the call. It was not frustration.

Then we have the coach condoning this behavior by slapping his player on the back and basically saying "atta boy"

Pete Booth

Good questions Pete however, when the tough games were scheduled as far as problem teams, my phone was the one that rang.

My games are NEVER out of control and I don't need to go on the field with a whip and an attitude. Maybe my years of doing Ice Hockey have given me a more relaxed way of handleing situations but I did not see this as a kid showing up an official. I also thought the coach was trying to calm the kid down and handleing the situation but, as always, being there may have been a different scenario.

As part of our training for Ice Hockey, we are taught to call the penalties that have an effect on the control and outcome of the game, and maybe overlook those that don't. It depends on flow, previous interaction and sometimes just experience or one's confidence in hisself to be able to reel that game in at any given second.

So this is baseball, not hockey! What has already been implied here is that, if this was another incident in a problem game it could result in an ejection. easily. I took it for what it was worth.

IMO, I don't need to show everyone all the time who their DADDY IS during the game because I KNOW I am. MY confidence of my skills and ability will always handle the game and I try to find ways to keep people playing.

I know others deal differently with this and that is their perogative however, I will go up against the best anytime an have complete confidence in what I do and know the outcome will be decided by the teams on a fair, level and controlled playing field.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by jicecone

Good questions Pete however, when the tough games were scheduled as far as problem teams, my phone was the one that rang.

My games are NEVER out of control and I don't need to go on the field with a whip and an attitude. Maybe my years of doing Ice Hockey have given me a more relaxed way of handleing situations but I did not see this as a kid showing up an official. I also thought the coach was trying to calm the kid down and handleing the situation but, as always, being there may have been a different scenario.

As part of our training for Ice Hockey, we are taught to call the penalties that have an effect on the control and outcome of the game, and maybe overlook those that don't. It depends on flow, previous interaction and sometimes just experience or one's confidence in hisself to be able to reel that game in at any given second.

So this is baseball, not hockey! What has already been implied here is that, if this was another incident in a problem game it could result in an ejection. easily. I took it for what it was worth.

IMO, I don't need to show everyone all the time who their DADDY IS during the game because I KNOW I am. MY confidence of my skills and ability will always handle the game and I try to find ways to keep people playing.

I know others deal differently with this and that is their perogative however, I will go up against the best anytime an have complete confidence in what I do and know the outcome will be decided by the teams on a fair, level and controlled playing field.

It's hard for you to imagine people acting like this on your field, then. Me too.

I was serious when I said that I simply don't tolerate this kind of behavior. Then again, the odds of me kicking one this badly are only infinitesimally greater than zero. Hard for me to put myself in this place. But the kid's second expression of disgust would be pretty hard for me to ignore, whether on the plate or the bases.

[BigTex]

Originally Posted by jicecone

As part of our training for Ice Hockey, we are taught to call the penalties that have an effect on the control and outcome of the game, and maybe overlook those that don't.

So what you are saying is that there may be a holding, tripping, boarding, etc somewhere away from the play and you can pass on it because it doesn't effect the control and outcome of the game? What about the power play you are not giving the offended team? Everything that happens on the ice (field, court, pitch, etc) plays a role in the outcome of the game. I am not advocating OOO, but who are you to decide what effects, or doesn't, the outcome of the game.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by BigTex

So what you are saying is that there may be a holding, tripping, boarding, etc somewhere away from the play and you can pass on it because it doesn't effect the control and outcome of the game? What about the power play you are not giving the offended team? Everything that happens on the ice (field, court, pitch, etc) plays a role in the outcome of the game. I am not advocating OOO, but who are you to decide what effects, or doesn't, the outcome of the game.

In football (for example), calling a holding penalty when the run is going the other direction and the person held has no chance to become involved is considered bad officiating.

However, that has nothing to do with unsportsmanlike conduct and bad behavior, so I'm not sure why it's in THIS thread.

[jicecone]

[QUOTE=RichMSN]In football (for example), calling a holding penalty when the run is going the other direction and the person held has no chance to become involved is considered bad officiating.

However, that has nothing to do with unsportsmanlike conduct and bad behavior, so I'm not sure why it's in THIS thread.[/B]

Sorry about that.

When I go out and buy your book, "Baseball Officiating by RichMSN," I will skip the chapter on game control because, wellll, your just "not sure."