Pre Game Discussions

[fitump56]

Originally Posted by mbyron
As BU I will make a call on a half-swing without being asked only when:

1. PU does not immediately say he went, and
2. he went, and
3. he can run to 1B (strike 3 with 1B not occupied or 2 outs).

If any of these conditions is not met, I wait until PU asks me.

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

Me, too, but I add:

4. We've discussed it in pre-game.

I decided to count the number of pre game discussions that not only these two posters admit to but several others. The time consumed by all these pre-game discussions is hours.

I am sure that many who do not work or have very flexible work schedules can hustle out to their local park for the 1730 or 1800 start and have time to make the ride, dress and hold these pre game discussions. Long pre game discussions.

Here's a fact. Most umpires are happy to work a full day and make the start time..on time. The idea that we have all these free minutes/hours to get to the game, get ready for the game and to have these pre game discussions is absurd.

[Rich]

I work with the same group of people all the time. I can count on one hand the number of games I've worked with someone other than my core 4-5 guys.

Our pregame discussion has been going on since 2002. On the way to the park, we usually discuss where we're going AFTER the game

[piaa_ump]

I am fortunate to be able to work the majority of my games with my regular partner....we have partnered up for about 7 years now.......our pregame conversation (and we ALWAYS have it) may last less than a minute, but which ever one of us has the plate that night will hold it.....

With other/infrequent partners, I make time to hold a pregame........it might be brief, But I am going to hit my list of hot points and get some confidence that we are on the same page.

[TussAgee11]

If you have time to change, you have time to have a pregame. When you work with those core partners it may be as short as 15 seconds. My pregame is this when I'm PU. It takes about 5 mins.

1) I'll rotate up to third with R1.
2) When I rotate I'll wait until you get into position, then I'll rotate back to mine.
3) I'll always have your help on swipe tags and pulled feet at first
4) I'm coming to you no matter where you are on checked swings, RHB or LHB.
5) Kill anything at my feet.
6) If you go out from A, I'll rotate up. Will you come back to the plate?
7) I'll help you on rundowns if there are no preceeding runners, and holler at you when I'm there.

I would go over catch/no catch stuff, but some of the people I end up working with its a challenge to get the 7 points above across. Also, when I'm BU, sometimes I have to ask my partner these points because he doesn't seem to intent on having a pregame.

Is that an efficiant pregame or is there something needed to be added that I miss?

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by TussAgee11

If you have time to change, you have time to have a pregame. When you work with those core partners it may be as short as 15 seconds. My pregame is this when I'm PU. It takes about 5 mins.

1) I'll rotate up to third with R1.
2) When I rotate I'll wait until you get into position, then I'll rotate back to mine.
3) I'll always have your help on swipe tags and pulled feet at first
4) I'm coming to you no matter where you are on checked swings, RHB or LHB.
5) Kill anything at my feet.
6) If you go out from A, I'll rotate up. Will you come back to the plate?
7) I'll help you on rundowns if there are no preceeding runners, and holler at you when I'm there.

I would go over catch/no catch stuff, but some of the people I end up working with its a challenge to get the 7 points above across. Also, when I'm BU, sometimes I have to ask my partner these points because he doesn't seem to intent on having a pregame.

Is that an efficiant pregame or is there something needed to be added that I miss?

I agree that it needn't take too long. I always try to cover "the second play in the infield" (BU or PU?)

Someone ( ) once wrote a really good article on this site (iirc) about what to cover in a pre-game -- the 5-7 "critical" items and the 5-7 "nice to have items).

That said, some conferences, especially at the higher levels, require a longer pre-game before the first game of a series.

[Tim C]

I seldom work with the same partner. I get with the same partner maybe three times a season.

For pre-game conference we teach in our state clinics a 30 minute conference with all points, a 15 minute conference with 6 critical issues, and (sadly) the five minute (as we walk to the field conference while late arriving partner is tucking in shirt) conference that covers a surface deep reveiw of three critical areas.

BTW, for playoff umpires we required a one hour pre-game conference which includes a mandatory walk around the field in street clothes done at check in time with the game managment.

Regards,

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by Tim C

BTW, for playoff umpires we required a one hour pre-game conference which includes a mandatory walk around the field in street clothes done at check in time with the game managment.

This is the same for here, except we only walk the field if we are unfamiliar with it. Most of our time is spent reviewing 3 (or 4) man mechanics.

[fitump56]

Originally Posted by Rich Fronheiser

I work with the same group of people all the time. I can count on one hand the number of games I've worked with someone other than my core 4-5 guys.

Our pregame discussion has been going on since 2002. On the way to the park, we usually discuss where we're going AFTER the game

You're very fortunate but the remaining 95% +/- of umpires are not. Which is my point about Pre Game and how so many on the Forum preach "this (issue, mechanic, rule, etc) can or should be covered in Pre Game."

It's BS and totally out of touch with reality.

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by fitump56

You're very fortunate but the remaining 95% +/- of umpires are not. Which is my point about Pre Game and how so many on the Forum preach "this (issue, mechanic, rule, etc) can or should be covered in Pre Game."

It's BS and totally out of touch with reality.

What do you recommend be covered at a minimum during a pre-game?


Tim.

[fitump56]

Originally Posted by piaa_ump

I am fortunate to be able to work the majority of my games with my regular partner....we have partnered up for about 7 years now.......our pregame conversation (and we ALWAYS have it) may last less than a minute, but which ever one of us has the plate that night will hold it.....

With other/infrequent partners, I make time to hold a pregame........it might be brief, But I am going to hit my list of hot points and get some confidence that we are on the same page.

What are your hotpoints and how much time do they take? What are your partners hot points and how much time do they take?

[fitump56]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

What do you recommend be covered at a minimum during a pre-game?


Tim.

I have none.

[RPatrino]

Fitty, you don't have a pre-game meeting with your partner(s)? Hmmmm...

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by fitump56

I have none.

I'm confused. You don't have a pre-game when you are working with a partner with whom you've never (or rarely) worked? Wow.

Here's a chance for you to make a difference and improive the quality of umpiring in your area. Take the lead on this and have a pre-game. Even during the walk to the field you can cover a few points.

[RPatrino]

I personally think he's jerking our chains...and rendering his input insignificant in the process.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by fitump56

I have none.

Now I've heard everything. YGTBSM. You don't have a pre-game talk with a new partner? How do you know that you are both on the same page? I can easily envision you both standing at 3rd base making different calls.

Even with guys I've worked many times with, we at least go over the essential coverages just to be sure.

I really hate trying to initiate a pre-game discussion, only to have my partner say something like, "I know what I'm supposed to do, and where I'm supposed to be, so I don't need to talk about it." These are the first guys to end up in the wrong place doing the wrong thing. Happens every time.