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  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 08:16pm
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I've finally seen it............

Having read this forum for a few years before joining, I have often heard of the "Little League Smitty", i.e. wearing a ball bag on the bases, brushing of the bases with a plate brush between innings, often. I personally had never seen this phenomenon. I took it to be an urban legend........

........until Friday.

I was asked to officiate at our local LL district tournament finals. During the game U2 and U3 brushed off the bases with a plate brush (U3 stored his in his trusty ball bag). U3 also scraped off the pitching rubber between innings.

After the game I was lauded by the UIC for doing an excellent job (had alot of bangers at 1st), but he said my mechanics were poor. I asked him to elaborate.

I didn't yell out "Foul" on every foul ball, I did not loudly verbalize "Out" on routine outs at 1st. And I challenged the notion that three good sized adults should "buttonhook" into the middle of the infield on base hits to the outfield.

Damn, all that money wasted at Evans and Gerry Davis clinics. I wonder if I can get my money back.
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 08:52pm
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I may be slow, but what is your point? I always brush off the bases. I never wear a ball bag on the bases. My question maybe worse than the Diebler but im lost...(see basketball forum for Diebler)But again Im a sports official,according to coaches I'm always lost.
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 09:43pm
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I will be nice . . . I will be nice . . . I will be nice

"NEohioref":

I just think you need to understand where many of us come from . . . brushing off bases SCREAMS (poorly trained) small diamond umpire.

We try hard on this site (each in our own way) to elevate, educate and share things that make umpires better.

Why would ANYONE brush off a base* . . . they are 4" high and everyone knows where they are.

It is similar to using an indicator on the bases. It just screams certain things to other umpires.

*Feel free to "brush a base" with your foot (no real base umpire would carry a brush on to the field) if two players are in "intense" conmversation . . . make sure you stand between them . . . otherwise leave the brushing of a base to the players.

Regards,

Jon Dielber is in MY HOF!
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 11:34pm
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Red face

Thanks for not ripping me a new one. I brush off bases in H.S,N.S.A,and little ball. It gives me something to do besides looking ugly,bored,lost.Do u not brush off the pitching plate? How do u handle dusty fields?(let the fielder handle it ,water them down i know)Again like you said to each there own. Please dont kill me guys,but I felt naked saturday w/o my brush. I left it in my other ball bag.That is the sign of a smitty more then brushing off bases.
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 11:42pm
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I don't make it a habit of brushing bases but there is one HS field I work that for some reason has a sandpit that serves as a second base cutout. The bases they use are of the same color (I think they were originally white but over time have become an off white). I will occasionally clean around the base area with my foot or ask a player to clean around the base just to give some contrast. This usually occurs after a couple of steals of 2nd in short order.

I can't understand why that area is such a mess. The head coach keeps the infield grass looking great, it's probably one of the best infields we have in the area.

Interesting sidebar on cleaning bases. Jim Evans recommends never cleaning a base. It has nothing to do with protocol or looking like a rookie. He says that a good cue to look for on a base touch by a runner is whether dirt flies off the bag as he attempts to touch the bag. Leaving dirt on the bag gives you an edge.



Lawrence
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 11:45pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim C
Why would ANYONE brush off a base* . . . they are 4" high and everyone knows where they are.
!
Then why do they change out the bases in MLB at least once per game (in many parks).

I often kick bases clean usually because I am also push-pulling the dirt away from the basepath side of the bag.

Timmie, maybe some of us are more concerned about showing effort, amking things better as best we can, and stewardship to the game than trying to meet silly standards "old hats" like you setup to determine who meets your expectations of a good umpire.
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 11:47pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitump56
Then why do they change out the bases in MLB at least once per game (in many parks).

I often kick bases clean usually because I am also push-pulling the dirt away from the basepath side of the bag.

Timmie, maybe some of us are more concerned about showing effort, amking things better as best we can, and stewardship to the game than trying to meet silly standards "old hats" like you setup to determine who meets your expectations of a good umpire.

Do the umpires change the bases in an MLB park?


Tim.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 11:52pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEohioref
Thanks for not ripping me a new one. I brush off bases in H.S,N.S.A,and little ball. It gives me something to do besides looking ugly,bored,lost.Do u not brush off the pitching plate? How do u handle dusty fields?(let the fielder handle it ,water them down i know)Again like you said to each there own.
No I would never brush off the pitching plate? What is the purpose of you doing this? Who cares about how dusty the field is. I can see the plate from any position on the field.

Secondly as someone who works other sports, it is common to see officials do things that make them look like a complete rookie. You will never see any higher level umpires do these the things you suggest. Just like you will never see high level officials in either baseball or football wear an adjustable hat. It just looks hokey.

Peace
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Old Sun Jul 15, 2007, 11:57pm
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Originally Posted by fitump56
Then why do they change out the bases in MLB at least once per game (in many parks).

I often kick bases clean usually because I am also push-pulling the dirt away from the basepath side of the bag.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigUmp56
Do the umpires change the bases in an MLB park?
Tim.
Why is it I feel like I am towing a piece of hamburger and there is a hungry dog snarfing my heels?

Point out where I said MLB umps do that but, of course, you knew I didn't. Hungry dogs snarf first, think later.

I suppose you don't clean the plate (what, you do?) and I am sure you don't clean the base fronts as I have said I do so above, is it below you or too far for you to walk?

Your turn.
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Last edited by fitump56; Tue Jul 17, 2007 at 12:42am.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon Jul 16, 2007, 12:01am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitump56
Timmie, maybe some of us are more concerned about showing effort, amking things better as best we can, and stewardship to the game than trying to meet silly standards "old hats" like you setup to determine who meets your expectations of a good umpire.
Do you realize how dumb that sounds? It is not just umpires that have these standards, it is the coaches. If you do things that make you stand out or look like you do not know what you are doing, they will try you more.

Let me ask you this. Do you go to a job interview in jeans and a T-shirt? No matter how qualified you think you are at anything, someone expects you to adhere to some standards in order to look or appear competent. I can tell by your postings competency is really not your strong suit.

Peace
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Old Mon Jul 16, 2007, 12:03am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim C
"NEohioref":

I just think you need to understand where many of us come from . . . brushing off bases SCREAMS (poorly trained) small diamond umpire.

We try hard on this site (each in our own way) to elevate, educate and share things that make umpires better.

Why would ANYONE brush off a base* . . . they are 4" high and everyone knows where they are.

It is similar to using an indicator on the bases. It just screams certain things to other umpires.

*Feel free to "brush a base" with your foot (no real base umpire would carry a brush on to the field) if two players are in "intense" conmversation . . . make sure you stand between them . . . otherwise leave the brushing of a base to the players.

Regards,

Jon Dielber is in MY HOF!

poorly trained small diamond ump..do we know where the base/playe is? Yes,,but a clean bag will also sell the call....
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Old Mon Jul 16, 2007, 12:06am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fitump56
Originally Posted by fitump56
Then why do they change out the bases in MLB at least once per game (in many parks).

I often kick bases clean usually because I am also push-pulling the dirt away from the basepath side of the bag.



Why is it I feel like I am towing a piece of hamburger and there is a hungry dog snarfing my heels?

Point out where I said MLB umps do that but, of course, you knew I didn't. Hungry dogs snarf first, think later.

I suppose you don't clean the plate (what, you do?) and I am sure you don't clean the base fronts as I have said I do so above, is it below you or to far for you to walk?

Your turn.

No need to get upset. I was just asking a question. I saw you were trying to draw a parallel between amature umpires brushing off the bases and certain MLB parks changing the bases entirely during a game. I didn't then, and still don't see the connection.

And yes, I clean the plate. Then again, it's not raised above the dirt by two to three inches like the bases are, so it can become quite covered up at times. Call me a stickler for details, but I like to see the plate when I'm trying to call balls and strikes.


And again, the answer is yes I'll kick the dirt off of a bag if it gets so covered that I might have a hard time seeing it. It doesn't happen a lot though as most of the fields I work aren't sand pits like some I've seen.


Tim.
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Old Mon Jul 16, 2007, 12:13am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lawrence.Dorsey
I don't make it a habit of brushing bases but there is one HS field I work that for some reason has a sandpit that serves as a second base cutout. The bases they use are of the same color (I think they were originally white but over time have become an off white). I will occasionally clean around the base area with my foot or ask a player to clean around the base just to give some contrast. This usually occurs after a couple of steals of 2nd in short order.

I can't understand why that area is such a mess. The head coach keeps the infield grass looking great, it's probably one of the best infields we have in the area.

Interesting sidebar on cleaning bases. Jim Evans recommends never cleaning a base. It has nothing to do with protocol or looking like a rookie. He says that a good cue to look for on a base touch by a runner is whether dirt flies off the bag as he attempts to touch the bag. Leaving dirt on the bag gives you an edge.

Lawrence
Chewed up dirt areas like you mention must be a PITA, I guess you have to dig them out completely and replace. 2B is a high action area.

Evans is a bright guy and the few umps I have had come through our org, who wanted to go Pro Ump, I recommended Jim. I call him "Jim" only because he and I have had many discussions about those who have taken his copyrighted works and sold or illegally distributed them. Sadly, I know these people and immediately turned them in
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Old Mon Jul 16, 2007, 08:02am
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~sigh~

"poorly trained small diamond ump..do we know where the base/playe is? Yes,,but a clean bag will also sell the call...."

So people in your games run around "looking for bases" . . . We all know where the bases are and so do runners. You have to have better logic than this to make sense.

Do u not brush off the pitching plate?

Please write and not text your questions.

No, I have never brushed off a pitcher's plate and we teach our umpires to NEVER do it either. Again all know where it is . . .

You didn't really have a question did you? You are just another umpire trying to make a point that basically is incorrect.
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Old Mon Jul 16, 2007, 08:54am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEohioref
poorly trained small diamond ump..do we know where the base/playe is? Yes,,but a clean bag will also sell the call....
Huh?

Actually, Jim Evans talks about the benefits of leaving dirt on the base -- a stab/kick at the base will kick dirt up and help the umpire make the call.

As far as cleaning the pitcher's plate, I know where it is. And if the pitcher is acting like a pitcher, he's ON the plate. I don't need to see it to know the rules surrounding "making a move associating with pitching."
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