throat guard discussion

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by nickrego

The fact of the matter is...The ball can easily get up under your cage, and severely damage your throat.

I'm curious as to how this can happen if your head is positioned properly. If you want to wear one as an additional safety measure, just say so. But to make the claim that a ball can easily get up under the cage is crying wolf.

Tim.

[ozzy6900]

I agree that if you are properly positioned and set, no ball should get under your mask. Note - this does not pertain to anyone using the scissors. The scissors puts your head out in front of your chest so a ball can sneak right up the "pipe" (windpipe that is).

[nickrego]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

I'm curious as to how this can happen if your head is positioned properly. If you want to wear one as an additional safety measure, just say so. But to make the claim that a ball can easily get up under the cage is crying wolf.

Tim.

Hmmm. Looked at yourself (in your stance) in the mirror lately ? Watched someone else in their stance lately ? I wonder why they sell Throat Guards ? I wonder why so many umpires use Throat Guards ? Is it just a great marketing ploy, to sell a totally useless product (like helmets) ?

Unless you stand with your chin on your chest, which I don't using the GD, a ball can easily get under the cage.

Unless...Your belly is far enough out and up to block the ball !

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by nickrego

Hmmm. Looked at yourself (in your stance) in the mirror lately ? Watched someone else in their stance lately ? I wonder why they sell Throat Guards ? I wonder why so many umpires use Throat Guards ? Is it just a great marketing ploy, to sell a totally useless product (like helmets) ?

Unless you stand with your chin on your chest, which I don't using the GD, a ball can easily get under the cage.

Unless...Your belly is far enough out and up to block the ball !

Like I said initially, you're crying wolf. If you want to wear one, go ahead, but don't think for a minute that you're going to sell me or anyone else with experience that a ball can easily get up under your cage. Looking at a helmet like the Wilson Vision, I don't even think they're made to accept the throat guards straps.





Tim.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

I agree that if you are properly positioned and set, no ball should get under your mask. Note - this does not pertain to anyone using the scissors. The scissors puts your head out in front of your chest so a ball can sneak right up the "pipe" (windpipe that is).

I've seen partners, in a heel/toe stance, take a foul that went off the bat, to the ground and then up under their mask and to the throat, on more than one occasion.

[etn_ump]

Garth,

The guy pictured obviously has no EXPERIENCE (according to Tim).

[BigUmp56]

Originally Posted by etn_ump

Garth,

The guy pictured obviously has no EXPERIENCE (according to

Tim).

He's not wearing a HSM. That's what I was talking about.


Tim.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by etn_ump

Garth,

The guy pictured obviously has no EXPERIENCE (according to Tim).

I believe Jason would take exception to that.

[BigUmp56]

You're right. No statistical analysis to support it. Only common sense would suggest that the extended length on a HSM provides more than adequate protection for the throat area.


Tim.

[nickrego]

Originally Posted by BigUmp56

Like I said initially, you're crying wolf. If you want to wear one, go ahead, but don't think for a minute that you're going to sell me or anyone else with experience that a ball can easily get up under your cage. Looking at a helmet like the Wilson Vision, I don't even think they're made to accept the throat guards straps.





Tim.

Nope, the ball can't get up under that cage, but it can get up under the chin guard. So you win the battle of Nit-Picking Words...Here's Your Sign !

This helmet, although it doesn't have an extended cage, looks to be no longer than my All-Star helmet's extended cage, which does allow for a Throat Protector.

I have never seen a Mask or Helmet that protected the throat. Nor have I seen a legitimately taught stance that places the bottom of the cage or chin guard against the chest, to protect the throat.

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by GarthB

I've seen partners, in a heel/toe stance, take a foul that went off the bat, to the ground and then up under their mask and to the throat, on more than one occasion.

Let's check out the stance of this D-1 umpire. It is clear that there is room for a baseball to get under his mask and either into his throat or chin.

Garth, this guy is so out of whack that even the best throat guard won't help him! This is almost what I looked like when I did LL eons ago. Yeah, I took a foul ball to the throat way back then but that is when I corrected my stance.

When I settle in the GDS, my back is pretty straight (thanks to missing parts). My mask is very close to the bump-out on my WVP so there is no room for a ball to get in there.

I also never used a throat guard when I used the scissors. I just didn't like them - period. Now, when my son started umpiring, I made him wear a throat guard.

I am in the same school as many others, if you want to wear a throat guard - wear one! You are just not going to convince me to wear something that I do not like.

[LLPA13UmpDan]

I honestly dont like them, but ive learned to live with it. 99% of umpires in our org. where one, as taught by our instructor.

[SAump]

Consider the requirements for NHL goalies. Do goalies in the NHL and below wear a clear throat guard attached to their HSM? Yes, because they recognize that the helmet alone does not properly protect their throat.

The first question I would ask after sustaining an injury, "Was I properly equipped?" Well, if you feel reasonably secure and ignorantly believe that you no longer need a throat guard, get rid of it and good luck.

Best wishes,

[Rich]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

Garth, this guy is so out of whack that even the best throat guard won't help him! This is almost what I looked like when I did LL eons ago. Yeah, I took a foul ball to the throat way back then but that is when I corrected my stance.

When I settle in the GDS, my back is pretty straight (thanks to missing parts). My mask is very close to the bump-out on my WVP so there is no room for a ball to get in there.

I also never used a throat guard when I used the scissors. I just didn't like them - period. Now, when my son started umpiring, I made him wear a throat guard.

I am in the same school as many others, if you want to wear a throat guard - wear one! You are just not going to convince me to wear something that I do not like.

This is a Division I college umpire. Apparently his stance works for him. Who are you to criticize it?

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by ozzy6900

Garth, this guy is so out of whack that even the best throat guard won't help him! This is almost what I looked like when I did LL eons ago. Yeah, I took a foul ball to the throat way back then but that is when I corrected my stance.

Let's see....D-1 official....2003 and 2004 Community College World Series....professionally trained...

Yeah.....he don't know squat.