when in doubt call...foul?

[ToGreySt]

had a Senior Babe Ruth game this week at an absolutely awful field, no foul lines beyond the bases and what lines were painted weren't much to speak of. Im on the bases and the batter hits a shot down the right field line while I'm in A. it's right over my head so I turn and start running out, but I get out there and I realize that I might not be able to tell without a reference, I turn a round and find the base and try to straddle it and line up with the foul pole. the ball, of course, comes down right on the line. I call foul.

During my apprentice program that my high school association put together, the instructors have talked about what to do when you're not 100% certain. for example, if a pitch is close enough to make you stop and think, it should be called a strike. same goes for a play on the bases, if it's too close to call it's an out. whether it's the right philosophy or not it got me though my first few games very well. My question is, do you give the same benefit of the doubt to the offence or the defense here? should the "when in doubt call" be fair or foul

just curious if this is a situation anybody else has encountered.

Joe

[ozzy6900]

Originally Posted by ToGreySt

had a Senior Babe Ruth game this week at an absolutely awful field, no foul lines beyond the bases and what lines were painted weren't much to speak of. Im on the bases and the batter hits a shot down the right field line while I'm in A. it's right over my head so I turn and start running out, but I get out there and I realize that I might not be able to tell without a reference, I turn a round and find the base and try to straddle it and line up with the foul pole. the ball, of course, comes down right on the line. I call foul.

SNIPPED

Joe

If they don't bother to put down the lines, you just do the best that you can. After that, don't beat yourself up!

[ctblu40]

I'm with nick on this one, when in doubt, call it fair. My theory is that if we're giving the pitcher the benifit of the doubt on close pitches, give the batter the benifit on fuzzy fair/foul calls.

[Blue37]

I sometimes encounter fields with no line past first or third base base, and also see fields with a line on the grass past first and third, but no line on the dirt between the bases and the grass. In either situation, we pregame it so the plate ump has fair/foul responsibility for balls hitting in those areas. He can establish a frame of reference by looking at the base and home. The field ump has no such frame of reference.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by Blue37

I sometimes encounter fields with no line past first or third base base, and also see fields with a line on the grass past first and third, but no line on the dirt between the bases and the grass. In either situation, we pregame it so the plate ump has fair/foul responsibility for balls hitting in those areas. He can establish a frame of reference by looking at the base and home. The field ump has no such frame of reference.

On most fields, and I'll admit there are exceptions, BU can line up the foul pole with a tree or a window, or a light pole, .... beyond the field. The time to set the reference is before the game starts. By using this, BU can get a pretty good look at the ball.

On the default -- if the batter "beat" the pitcher (that is, pulled the ball hard), I rule it fair. Otherwise, I rule it foul.

[Dave Hensley]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

On most fields, and I'll admit there are exceptions, BU can line up the foul pole with a tree or a window, or a light pole, .... beyond the field. The time to set the reference is before the game starts. By using this, BU can get a pretty good look at the ball.

On the default -- if the batter "beat" the pitcher (that is, pulled the ball hard), I rule it fair. Otherwise, I rule it foul.

This is #2 in my "Summer ball mechanics" manual (self-authored, but regrettably unavailable to the masses just yet). On fields that haven't been lined, BU comes in and pivots on that play, and PU takes the catch/no catch and fair/foul call. PU has 1B and the foul pole to use as reference. Bob's suggestion proves that he's never umpired in Texas, where typically the "object" behind the baseball field is the high school football practice field, and beyond that, the lone prairie.

[ToGreySt]

Originally Posted by GarthB

The "line" is fair.

I guess what I should have said was it came down where it could have been either, with no line I had no real idea where it was

Joe

[nickrego]

I agree with all your other "Too Close To Tell" philosophies, but for a Foul Ball, if it's too close to call, I lean to wards FAIR.

[SanDiegoSteve]

In a whole lot more games than I would like, there are no foul lines past the infield dirt. In some HS summer games, there are no foul lines whatsoever. In these situations, it's whatever you call it, and if they complain, tell 'em to line the field next time.

[GarthB]

Originally Posted by nickrego

I agree with all your other "Too Close To Tell" philosophies, but for a Foul Ball, if it's too close to call, I lean to wards FAIR.

It depends on why the umpire missed seeing the call. If he was blocked out somehow, and the teams aren't making a clear call for him, the default should be foul. If he is merely working a crap field, he doesn't need a default, he just calls what he has. As SDS said, if they don't like the calls, they can line the field next time.