Do you count the run?

[UMP25]

Here's one that's got some associates of mine all flustered (I haven't told them the answer yet):

PLAY: Two outs and a runner on third base when an improper batter is at bat (Frank is batting but Edward is supposed to bat). The batter walks on ball four, a pitch that happens to get away from the catcher. R3 on third trots home on the wild pitch. The defensive manager then comes out to appeal the batting out of order. The umpire grants the appeal, declaring out Edward for not batting in his proper slot, and removes Frank from first base, inning over. Here's the question: do you count R3's run?

[UmpJM]

UMP25,

No.

JM

[UMP25]

I think I intentionally confused many of them by reminding them that advances by runners due to balks or wild pitches when an improper batter is at bat do count. Not that this means the run counts. Just throwing that out there to further confuse the masses.

[yankeesfan]

Originally Posted by UMP25

I think I intentionally confused many of them by reminding them that advances by runners due to balks or wild pitches when an improper batter is at bat do count. Not that this means the run counts. Just throwing that out there to further confuse the masses.

if the wild pitch happened on ball three and the runner from third scored then the run would of counted? is this correct?

[UmpJM]

Yankeesfan,

That would be absolutely correct.

JM

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by yankeesfan

if the wild pitch happened on ball three and the runner from third scored then the run would of counted? is this correct?

Trick question, right? That's NOT correct. The run would HAVE counted.

[yankeesfan]

Originally Posted by mbyron

Trick question, right? That's NOT correct. The run would HAVE counted.

what are you talking about? thats what i said.

[SanDiegoSteve]

Originally Posted by UMP25

I think I intentionally confused many of them by reminding them that advances by runners due to balks or wild pitches when an improper batter is at bat do count. Not that this means the run counts. Just throwing that out there to further confuse the masses.

That is because R3 scored because he was awarded home on ball four in this case, and not as the result of a wild pitch or a balk. The fact that ball four was also a wild pitch does not mean R3's run counts for this very reason. On proper appeal, R3's run is negated.

[UmpJM]

S.D. Steve,

I believe that in UMP25's sitch, the R3 is the only baserunner. Therefore, there is no award to the R3 on the ball 4 (wild) pitch to the batter.

JM

[SanDiegoSteve]

Man, I'm not reading well lately.

[bob jenkins]

WUA has opined on this play. I'm "sure" someone at eteamz has the email

[UMP25]

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

WUA has opined on this play. I'm "sure" someone at eteamz has the email

Did they? I don't even remember if I Emailed any of my friends in MLB.

[UMP25]

OK, now that my evil attempt to sow discord, discontent, and division has been successful (don't underestimate the Power of the Dark Side), here is THE official ruling on this play:

No run.

Pursuant to OBR 4.09(a)(1) and NCAA 5-6-c(1).

Many thanks to my friend Rick Roder for confirming this before I stated it here. Now that I've got half my own association swearing revenge on me for this one, I think it's time to wrap up this specific one.

I KNEW there was a reason I rubbed the nose of my life-size Darth Vader everytime I left in the morning.

[DG]

Originally Posted by UMP25

OK, now that my evil attempt to sow discord, discontent, and division has been successful (don't underestimate the Power of the Dark Side), here is THE official ruling on this play:

No run.

Pursuant to OBR 4.09(a)(1) and NCAA 5-6-c(1).

Many thanks to my friend Rick Roder for confirming this before I stated it here. Now that I've got half my own association swearing revenge on me for this one, I think it's time to wrap up this specific one.

I KNEW there was a reason I rubbed the nose of my life-size Darth Vader everytime I left in the morning.

Your friend Rick contradicts himself, "A runner who advanced for some other reason (wild pickoff throw overthrow, wild pitch, balk) is allowed his advance. 6.07b2".

Your reference to 4.09(a)(1) and 5-6-c(1) would require the coach to come running out of the dugout to appeal the BOO while the catcher is retrieving the pass ball and before the B-R reaches 1B.

[UMP25]

No it wouldn't. BTW, the Rick to whom I refer is Rick Roder of the Jaksa/Roder manual. You're making the error of thinking of this as some sort of time play. When it comes down to it, it is an advance that occurred on a play involving a batter not reaching first base for the final out.

No run.