|
Fri Feb 03, 2006, 08:15pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
The sad fact of the matter is you're right, Windy. MiLB won't lose any sleep over replacing these umpires if need be. They'll still sells tickets and merchandise without a hitch.
I pray for their sakes it doesn't come to that. Tim. 
|
|
Fri Feb 03, 2006, 08:31pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
WCB wrote: "According to their stats, a Rookie umpire makes about $1,800 a month, plus benefits, housing and per diem. A thirty five percent increase is preposterous. Corporate America averages 3-5% merit increases. That seems awfully selfish."
Problem is - there's been no raise for 10 years if their claim is correct. Thus the equivalent of going from 1,800 to 2,430 (a 35% increase) over the 10 years is a rate of increase of 3.0465% per year (it compounds folks). Seems to me like that's less than the 3-5% you seem to think os OK.
__________________
Rich Ives Different does not equate to wrong
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 02:51am
|
|||
|
|||
|
Well, Rich, that would make sense if you didn't assume that they were overpaid ten years ago. The fact that they have not bargained for a raise over those years is suspect.
Look at how much umpiring has changed in the last ten years. The guys that were working ten years ago aren't even there now!
__________________
"You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers. You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions. ~Naguib Mahfouz
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 07:40am
|
|||
|
|||
|
Hmmm,
History isn't really that important for this precise issue.
What is important is that this is the first contract that is being considered with an umpire union involved. We really can't compare professional minor league umpire salaries from 10 years ago, five years, ago or even three years ago. Since there was no minor league union in those days there were never any serious discussions from umpires concerning pay rates. We know from history that Steve Mattingly was released from his AAA contract because he began to organize the AMLU. His situation was much like Bill Valentine in MLB in the 1960's, the way organized professional baseball dealt with unionism was to cut loose the organizers. FEAR often kept umpires from attempting any type of organizing. What is relevant in this conversation is one thing and one thing only: "What is the current value of an umpire at each level of the minor leagues?" No one can force considerations of sins from the past. We live in a real time economy and all that matters is what price are people willing to pay for a specific service. Do professional umpires deserve more money? Maybe.
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 09:28am
|
|||
|
|||
|
Tee,
This actually is not the first contract AMLU is bargaining for. This is their second. During the first contract, signed just after NLRB recognized them as a union in their field, there wasn't much haggling about salaries. As I understand, the additions they wanted were fairly minor. These included increased per diems, single motel rooms for umpires at Long-A and above, and the courtesy of flying them home for the dead period between spring training and the start of their league season. There may have been more but those are things I remember. That contract was signed 3-4 years ago to the best of my memory. Prior to that there was no bargaining ability for MiLB umpires so the salary and benefits was whatever NAPBL said it would be. Lawrence
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 10:00am
|
|||
|
|||
|
LD:
The first contract was to recognize the union itself. The changes in pay rates were established at that time and the length of contract established.
There was really no negotiation as MiLB placed values into the contract as a starting point. The contract, three years in length I believe, was ratified by the rank and file with little discussion. At no time during the initial contract was there a discussion of a strike or lock out by either side. This is the first negotiation that the union itself is doing.
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 10:07am
|
|||
|
|||
|
...
I believe the first contract was 5 years long.
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 10:42am
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Just pointing out that a 35% increase after 10 years is equivalent to getting 3.0465% per year during the same period. Not a preposterous selfish increase as you opined.
__________________
Rich Ives Different does not equate to wrong
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 01:33pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Re: Hmmm,
Quote:
"Need" and "Deserve" are PR terms used in negotiations. Management will decided at what point they will be willing to do without the current umpires and the umpires will decide at what point they will be willing to look for different work. If the offer is somewhere in between, a contract will be signed. There's no need to lose sleep over it. This isn't the Sistine Chapel or the cure to cancer. It's minor league baseball and, like it or not, the umpire is one of the more interchangeable pieces. There are plenty of replacement pieces available. They may not start out performing as well, but they will get there over time. And, who or what has more time than minor league baseball. Almost everybody else there has no where else to go right now. Edited to add: I don't write this out of lack of empathy. My association is going through a similar issue, albeit at a lower level. The local American Legion Baseball League has offered us a new agreement in which there is no compensation for mileage, No raise in umpiring fees at the AA and AAA levels, tournaments would pay $10 less per umpire, and the assigning fee would be 1/6th of what it costs to do business with them. We have countered with a one-time final proposal that would call for slight increases in fees, no penalties for tournament work, and an increase in the assinging fee to 1/3rd of what it costs to do business with them. We were willing to swallow hard and not address the mileage issue at this time. We are not whining about what we deserve or need. We have simply explained to them the minimum of what we will accept. If they decide they are not willing pay that amount, we will not work their games and they will find other umpires elsewhere. [Edited by GarthB on Feb 4th, 2006 at 02:11 PM]
__________________
GB
|
|
Sat Feb 04, 2006, 07:22pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
It seems funny that TAC, Garth and I actually can agree on something.
Rich, I usually like reading your posts but these past few are a touch unnerving. If they signed an agreement five years ago for the salary they currently make, then they have no grounds for *****ing about the past five years! Most of us recognize that they deserve more money, we all want more for our games. More than a few of us have an issue with demanding so much more or they will walk away. That is an empty threat as they will be easily replaced. Sure the talent level will be different, but that happens in every amateur game across America. Just because you had a great crew for the last game, doesnt mean that today's will be the same. All of us pay more for the necessities of life. The cost of living has risen dramatically. Turning your back on an income in this day and age borders on stupidity. They need to reorganize, hire better attorneys and bargain for a contract that acknowledges that they are simply a resource, not the driving force in MiLB. If they don't recognize that soon, they will be working amateur ball and lose any hope of walking onto the field at Yankee Stadium as an MLB crew member.
__________________
"You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers. You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions. ~Naguib Mahfouz
|
|
Sun Feb 05, 2006, 11:01am
|
|||
|
|||
|
"all of us pay more for the neccessities of life" ... including MiLB umpires. But their pay has not increased accordingly and their purchashing power has decreased. This is something you continually refuse to acknowledge.
"Turning your back on an income in this day and age borders on stupidity." - as does continuing to work ad undervalued wages. Last edited by dontcallmeblue; Sun Apr 02, 2006 at 11:09am.
|
|
Sun Feb 05, 2006, 01:27pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
__________________
GB
|
|
Sun Feb 05, 2006, 03:57pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
Keep on posting, Garth. A little levity livens things up.
|
|
Sun Feb 05, 2006, 04:43pm
|
|||
|
|||
|
Quote:
In the semi-free market system in which we live, if one doesn't like his pay or his working conditions or his boss or whatever, he is free to move on to another position which he will find more to his liking. What the heck is smartass about that? Unless you're under the age of 16, you should understand that each one of us is soley responsible for our actions and we thus accept both the rewards and the consequences of those actions. And that includes the decisions we make as to where we work. [Edited by GarthB on Feb 5th, 2006 at 04:51 PM]
__________________
GB
|
 |
| Bookmarks |
|
|
Linear Mode
