Advice, please

[Lawrence_Dorsey]

Last year I saw a varsity head bb coach, who referees football in the fall (at the varsity level), kick dirt at my partner in an argument. I still can't believe it but the BU didn't dump him.

Lawrence

[umpire29]

mnref,
dumping him was the right thing to do. Forfeiting was the wrong thing to do as you took it out on the kids for having a idiotic coach. As for the other half of your question, there was an incident like that only it was a football coach who did what your baseabll coach did and he too was an official. The linesman of the game wrote the ohsaa about the coach/official and they suspended his officiating license. I am not saying that its a good thing to do but it is an option. He should understand he is part of the brother hood, as i am sure if the situation was reversed he would have done the same thing. I hope the rest of your season gets better.

[tmp44]

Originally posted by umpire29
mnref,
dumping him was the right thing to do. Forfeiting was the wrong thing to do as you took it out on the kids for having a idiotic coach.

Umpire29,

I'm not sure I completely agree with you here. If a coach or coaches get out of control to the point where an official must call the game, then that's the action that must be done. I'm not saying that mnref didn't pull the trigger a little early here (although none of us were at the game), but if he felt that a forfeit was warranted, then it was warranted, at least by the person that mattered. It's not the official's fault that the game is forfeited, no matter whether the kids got to decide the game or not...the coach or coaches decided it for them by completely getting out of control. Case in point, I remember seeing on the basketball board a few weeks ago an official who ended the game because both the assistant and head coaches got ejected. Now, was the official here supposed to not make the final ejection just so the kids could finish the game? Absolutely not...if the ejection and foreiture is warranted, then it should be done. PERIOD. Here is the link to that thread: http://www.officialforum.com/thread/19037

On a side note, mnref, what if anything did your partner say/do after you forfeited the game? Did he back you on it?

[mcrowder]

Being a multi-sport official myself, I've noticed one thing about myself...

The first few baseball games of the year, I'm WAY WAY too lenient dealing with coaches. Still in the "football mentality" I suppose.

The first couple of football games of the year, I'm WAY WAY too quick on the trigger dealing with coaches. Still in the Baseball Mentality.

You, having football background, may have been too lenient (I'm not sure what the basketball atmosphere is like - I would think, from watching on TV, that it's more like baseball than football... but in baseball you don't have the option of a Technical Foul. Perhaps you were using the ejection as your 1st T and the forfeit as your 2nd.

I agree with the majority - too lenient on the ejection, but FAR to quick to forfeit. Like one poster said, if we're at the point of forfeit, we're probably at the point of this guy being fired.

[nmref]

Originally posted by tmp44
On a side note, mnref, what if anything did your partner say/do after you forfeited the game? Did he back you on it? [/B]

tmp44,

Yes, my partner did back me on my decision, and we discussed it on the way to go change. We were in agreement that it was warranted and that, in light of the coach's failure to leave the field following his ejection and his threats toward me, calling the game was the right thing to do. We both felt he was given ample time to leave the field, and simply chose not to do so.

Again, thanks everyone, for your advice and help. It will help me be a better umpire and handle situations like that better in the future. I understand that many feel I may have pulled the trigger too fast on calling the game, but in that situation I felt it was the right thing to do.

[jicecone]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by nmref

Originally posted by tmp44
On a side note, mnref, what if anything did your partner say/do after you forfeited the game? Did he back you on it?
tmp44,

Yes, my partner did back me on my decision, and we discussed it on the way to go change. We were in agreement that it was warranted and that, in light of the coach's failure to leave the field following his ejection and his threats toward me, calling the game was the right thing to do. We both felt he was given ample time to leave the field, and simply chose not to do so.

Again, thanks everyone, for your advice and help. It will help me be a better umpire and handle situations like that better in the future. I understand that many feel I may have pulled the trigger too fast on calling the game, but in that situation I felt it was the right thing to do.

"I know this is a baseball board, butany advice on this issue would be appreciated.

Once again, I appreciate the help."

I realize now I may have been too quick-triggered in calling the game"

NM, You have gone full circle in your posts here, take this as advice and lets call it quits.

I evaulate Ice Hockey officials every year and the biggest problem they have after I tell them what they did wrong, is to try an justify, that what they did, was right. It is like going in one ear and out the other. The successful young officials that move up, have learned to "JUST LISTEN." Think about the advice you were given.

Many have told you that forfeiting a game is very very rare and extreme. Collectively there is probably a cumlative experience here of several, several thousands of baseball contests. (TC alone had half) We are not perfect but this experience was gained at probably every level from college, semi-pro and below.

Please, please, please, take this as constructive as possible for the development of you own baseball officiating career, JUST LISTEN.

[DG]

I have only been involved in one game in my life that was forfeited because a coach would not leave, and from the beginning of the argument to the forfeit was a good 8 minutes or so, and it was a 13-15 game, so no real big deal, except to the coach who was relieved of his duties by the league. I have never had a situation get so bad in a HS game, and my state hates HS forfeits so I think I would treat it like a lightning delay, and if he will not leave for 30 minutes then it will be obvious to all who is at fault here. Too slow on the restriction/ejection, the forfeit should be last resort to get you home.

[Edited by DG on Apr 4th, 2005 at 10:35 PM]