Obstruction

[CorrectCall]

Runner slides into catcher's foot, which was blocking the plate, without catcher having possession of the ball. A tag is applied before runner touches home plate, but runner is ruled safe based on obstruction. Runner never actually touches the plate and returns to the dugout. Defensive teams appeals and runner is ruled out for failing to touch home plate. Offensive coach states that the runner was AWARED home on obstruction and, in this case, his runner would have touched home if the plate was not physically blocked. Is an out recorded on appeal or does the run score even though the plate was not touched by the obstructed runner?

[bob jenkins]

if the OBS is the proximate cause of the runner missing the base, then deny the appeal. This has nothing to do with the base being "awarded" to the runner.

[Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.]

Originally Posted by CorrectCall

Runner slides into catcher's foot, which was blocking the plate, without catcher having possession of the ball. A tag is applied before runner touches home plate, but runner is ruled safe based on obstruction. Runner never actually touches the plate and returns to the dugout. Defensive teams appeals and runner is ruled out for failing to touch home plate. Offensive coach states that the runner was AWARED home on obstruction and, in this case, his runner would have touched home if the plate was not physically blocked. Is an out recorded on appeal or does the run score even though the plate was not touched by the obstructed runner?

Originally Posted by bob jenkins

if the OBS is the proximate cause of the runner missing the base, then deny the appeal. This has nothing to do with the base being "awarded" to the runner.

Bob:

I don't know about OBR and NCAA, but under NFHS awarded bases must still be touched and the appeal would be upheld.

MTD, Sr.

[bob jenkins]

Not in my game (in the play presented).

I *think* there's some wording to the effect you mention in the book -- but it's intended (imo) to apply where Br is obstructed rounding first and is awarded third -- of course he must touch second or be liable to be out on appeal. It isn't meant to apply in situations like the OP.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by Mark T. DeNucci, Sr.

Bob:

I don't know about OBR and NCAA, but under NFHS awarded bases must still be touched and the appeal would be upheld.

MTD, Sr.

Has FED gotten back to you regarding your query about a missed base due to obstruction?

[MD Longhorn]

In this play, home must be touched.

The J/R ruling regarding "if the OBS is the proximate cause of the runner missing the base," applies to cases like this:

Runner rounding first heading toward 2nd is prevented from touching first by F3, and continues to 2nd safely. Defense then appeals the miss at first.

[umpjim]

I think we would have to know how the umpire called the obstruction. If he called time "that's obstruction, you home" I think the runner would know to touch home. If he called "that's obstruction, safe" I would not allow the appeal.

[bob jenkins]

Originally Posted by umpjim

I think we would have to know how the umpire called the obstruction. If he called time "that's obstruction, you home" I think the runner would know to touch home. If he called "that's obstruction, safe" I would not allow the appeal.

it might also depend on whether the runner was blocked short of the plate or blocked past/around/by the plate.

In any event, the defense messed up, so 100% of the benefit of the doubt to the offense here.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by umpjim

Has FED gotten back to you regarding your query about a missed base due to obstruction?

I don't know if FED has responded to Mark but I discovered this clip on the Arbiter NFHS website. If it doesn't play you probably need to be a member. But, it shows obstruction causing a miss of 3B and says to award the obstruction penalty but if the miss is appealed it will be an out. I would not call that particular play likethat in NCAA or OBR.
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[Matt]

Originally Posted by umpjim

I don't know if FED has responded to Mark but I discovered this clip on the Arbiter NFHS website. If it doesn't play you probably need to be a member. But, it shows obstruction causing a miss of 3B and says to award the obstruction penalty but if the miss is appealed it will be an out. I would not call that particular play likethat in NCAA or OBR.
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Why not? It's the right call in all of them.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by Matt

Why not? It's the right call in all of them.

The FED video of the obstruction is IMHO a good example of obstruction causing a missed 3B. Both OBR and NCAA have interps that allow the umpire to consider the base touched. It is now clear that FED does not abide by the other codes' interp. I can't get the screenshots of the video to upload.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by umpjim

The FED video of the obstruction is IMHO a good example of obstruction causing a missed 3B. Both OBR and NCAA have interps that allow the umpire to consider the base touched. It is now clear that FED does not abide by the other codes' interp. I can't get the screenshots of the video to upload.

Screenshots URL:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzA...ew?usp=sharing

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BzA...ew?usp=sharing

[Matt]

Originally Posted by umpjim

The FED video of the obstruction is IMHO a good example of obstruction causing a missed 3B. Both OBR and NCAA have interps that allow the umpire to consider the base touched. It is now clear that FED does not abide by the other codes' interp. I can't get the screenshots of the video to upload.

Ok, I was referring to the OP, not the video...short of a defender laying on top of home plate for hours on end or contact that sends a runner flying into DBT (both infinitesimally likely,) OBS can never be the proximate cause of a runner missing home. He's no longer liable to be put out, he has no other responsibilities, he can come back and touch it.

Not a fan of making a runner touch on OBS that causes him to miss a base. I get the logic, but it's also contrary to other FED logic that takes things out of our hands. In this case, they expect a runner to be further disadvantaged by mandating he touch a missed base and for us to consider that in our awards.

[umpjim]

Originally Posted by Matt

Ok, I was referring to the OP, not the video...short of a defender laying on top of home plate for hours on end or contact that sends a runner flying into DBT (both infinitesimally likely,) OBS can never be the proximate cause of a runner missing home. He's no longer liable to be put out, he has no other responsibilities, he can come back and touch it.

Not a fan of making a runner touch on OBS that causes him to miss a base. I get the logic, but it's also contrary to other FED logic that takes things out of our hands. In this case, they expect a runner to be further disadvantaged by mandating he touch a missed base and for us to consider that in our awards.

I would agree that in the OP the runner should come back and touch HP if the umpire said "time, that's obstruction, you HP". If the umpire said "that's obstruction, safe", I would not hold the runner responsible but the OP umpire might anyway if he mistakenly used that mechanic. If I mistakenly used that mechanic, which is possible in the heat of the moment, I would not rule the runner out.

[DG]

Check page 239 of 2015 BRD, item 368. According to this FED is treated same as NCAA and OBR. The example under OBR is F2 misses 3b due to obstruction and is safe on a close play at the plate. Defense appeals missed 3b. In FED/NCAA appeal is denied. In OBR it is umpire judgment, and as explained earlier judgment as to whether the runner would have touched absent the obstruction.