Is there an easy way?

[Ray_from_Mi]

I have a couple of questions that I would like to be clear on.
1.) When stepping on the centerline, in order to have a violation, does the whole foot need to be past the centerline? or can any part of the foot be considered in violation? Also, does this apply to any other part of the body? (i.e. hand, knee, elbow, etc...)
2.) Illegal alignment, is there an easy way to call IA? or is it as complicated as what others who try to explain it make it seem? Is alignment front to back as well as side to side? Can a front row player be behind a back row player (Rf behind the CB or RB) Does IA concern the setter as well? or is this person absolved from IA.

Any help on these two subjects would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,

[IHSAref]

The foot needs to be completely over the centerline for there to be a violation. No other part of the body can be on or over the line.

[FMadera]

1) See 9-5-7.
2) See 6-3-3. RB, for example, can overlap RF, but not CF. No player is exempt from alignment except for the a server who can be to the left of the CB when he/she contacts serve. (Exempt from alignment, of course, doesn't mean they can serve out of order.)

[FMadera]

Originally Posted by IHSAref

The foot needs to be completely over the centerline for there to be a violation. No other part of the body can be on or over the line.

Wrong.

Any part of the body can be on the line. The hand or foot can be beyond the center line, provided some part is on or over.

Any other body part beyond the center line is illegal. Beyond, not "on."

[IHSAref]

I ment to say can not be on or over...i need to take typing 101 again

[FMadera]

Originally Posted by IHSAref

I ment to say can not be on or over...i need to take typing 101 again

But your statement was still incorrect in two ways.

1. The hand may also be over, so long as part of it is on or above the line.
2. Any other body part may be on the line. The line is still part of that team's area (same with the other team as well). Being on the line is still being in your team's area, and is not illegal. Therefore, it's not illegal for another body part to be on the line. It is only illegal for a body part that is not a hand or foot to be BEYOND the center line.

Touching line - OK
Touching wood or sport court beyond the line - BAD

Unless, of course, there's interference, but that's another discussion for another day.

[refnrev]

Nope, there's not an easy way with IA ... just like the block/charge or travel/no travel etc. in basketball aren't easy. At times it will jump out at you and at times you will be blind to it. Experience and practice help, but it's tough to learn, especially if, like nearly all of us guys, you didn't play it or coach it. I think someone mentioned going over the case book pictures. Do it over and over and over.... but every now and then you'll get a complex formation like we had last night. It was legal, but it sure looked close to overlapping. Good luck! And do what I do.. keep asking questions.

[MCBear]

IF you have a good scorekeeper, they can help you out. During your prematch discussion with your scorekeeper, tell them that there are times that you will ask them to give you the NEXT THREE SERVERS on either the right side or the left side. When you ask that question, the scorekeeper will give you the numbers of the front row players in order. Find those three numbers on the court and they MUST be closer to the net than 3 other players. If they aren't closer to the net (centerline) than the other 3 players on their team, you can be 99.99% sure that there is an overlap.

There are times that coaches come up the gol-darndest serve-receive formations that I have ever seen. When that happens, I am asking my scorekeeper for information constantly so that I can figure out what the heck they are doing (and I am usually pretty good at tracking the players on the court...but there are definitely times!!!).

[FMadera]

Originally Posted by MCBear

IF you have a good scorekeeper, they can help you out. During your prematch discussion with your scorekeeper, tell them that there are times that you will ask them to give you the NEXT THREE SERVERS on either the right side or the left side. When you ask that question, the scorekeeper will give you the numbers of the front row players in order. Find those three numbers on the court and they MUST be closer to the net than 3 other players. If they aren't closer to the net (centerline) than the other 3 players on their team, you can be 99.99% sure that there is an overlap.

There are times that coaches come up the gol-darndest serve-receive formations that I have ever seen. When that happens, I am asking my scorekeeper for information constantly so that I can figure out what the heck they are doing (and I am usually pretty good at tracking the players on the court...but there are definitely times!!!).

Jan,

Your statement can be read as implying that all three front row players need to be in front of all three back row players. While I know that's not the case, and I know you know that's not the case, it could be confusing to others.

But yes, the scorekeeper can be an invaluable aide in getting your bearings set, even with a lineup card.

[MCBear]

I totally blew this one, Felix - Thanks for calling me on it. I was thinking left and right stacks where the three front row players are pulled all the way to one sideline or the other. I wasn't thinking about using a 3-person receive pattern (among others that are legal) where the LF and CF pull up close to the net near the left sideline, the LB, CB and RF are the primary passers and the RB is stuck in the far back corner because she can't pass worth a hoot!

Oh, well! I tried to make it simple, but I guess there really ISN'T a simple way to see IA except to get the experience to recognize it.

[TimTaylor]

Originally Posted by refnrev

Nope, there's not an easy way with IA ... just like the block/charge or travel/no travel etc. in basketball aren't easy. At times it will jump out at you and at times you will be blind to it. Experience and practice help, but it's tough to learn, especially if, like nearly all of us guys, you didn't play it or coach it. I think someone mentioned going over the case book pictures. Do it over and over and over.... but every now and then you'll get a complex formation like we had last night. It was legal, but it sure looked close to overlapping. Good luck! And do what I do.. keep asking questions.

I agree, but if you keep after it it will eventually click. It happened to me about half way through my second season. Jan and Felix are correct that the scorekeeper can be great resource - don't be afraid to use them.

Studying the case book pictures helps, but watching the real thing is better. On nights you're not working, go watch one of the higher level matches in your area and try tracking the alignments - you'll be surprised how much you will see. It may not work for everyone, but I know it helped me. Now if I can only get FR/BR down as the R...it's getting better, but I've still got a ways to go.......

[refnrev]

Some people find tracking the rotation much easier when you use the wheel. I personally am a 3x5 card guy, but many like the wheel. As toolman said, it does begin to click and jump out at you... but every now and then I just go blind to it. It isn't as easy for me as it is for some officials.

[bbsbvb83]

Originally Posted by FMadera

1) See 9-5-7.
2) See 6-3-3. RB, for example, can overlap RF, but not CF. No player is exempt from alignment except for the a server who can be to the left of the CB when he/she contacts serve. (Exempt from alignment, of course, doesn't mean they can serve out of order.)

Felix:

Did you intend to say, "RB, for example, can overlap CF, but not RF."?

I believe if RB overlaps RF at the moment the ball is contacted for the serve, illegal alignment has occurred.

[FMadera]

Originally Posted by bbsbvb83

Felix:

Did you intend to say, "RB, for example, can overlap CF, but not RF."?

I believe if RB overlaps RF at the moment the ball is contacted for the serve, illegal alignment has occurred.

No, I meant to say RB can overlap RF, (and it would be illegal for that to occur), but you can never have a situation where RB is overlapping CF. Not possible, by rule.