Procedural Question

[derwil]

Area tournaments are here!!!

Problem I have is that one of the Areas I will be doing on Thursday has a field crew that either a) doesn't know how to draw a batter's box or b) draws it poorly to help the home team. Either way, the home team crowds the plate if you let them to the point that they are literally 2 inches off of it and hanging into the zone. I've called dead ball strikes on the batters for getting hit while in the strike zone but they come right back in. It really suck because you CAN NOT see the ball coming into the plate - gotta watch the catcher's glove or (I really don't like doing this) move to the other side of the catcher - head position only, not stance.

So, if I get to the field on Thursday and see crappy lines drawn, should I ask for them to be redrawn or kill the chalk mark myself or what? This will be my second time there so I learned a little from the first experience and talking to others about it. I will enforce the "6 inches from the plate" box and keep them in it till the ball is thrown. I just want to know what to do with the lines that are drawn on the field.

[NCASAUmp]

I always do one of two things: either wipe the lines out, or advise both coaches that the lines are drawn incorrectly and remind them that it's my judgment, reassuring them that I'll give batters a bit of leeway.

Wiping out the lines, in my opinion, is better from a game management standpoint. It reduces the temptation coaches have to focus solely on the bad lines, even if you DID tell them during the plate conference that the lines are wrong. However, it also may have the effect of "thumbing your nose" at the local field crew.

The choice is yours.

[tcblue13]

Since I do Fed ball and they have a rule about wiping lines, I don't do that. But, I will bring it to the coaches attention in the plate mtg and pretty much do like Dave said, let them know it's my judgment. I see fields with all kinds of line and box bobbles. Had one two weeks ago where the foul line was drawn 2 inches outside the base and another field where the line was off from the foul pole by a foot and a half. Tell the coaches you will use your best judgment and play ball.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by tcblue13

Since I do Fed ball and they have a rule about wiping lines, I don't do that.

The rule is to prevent participants from obliterating valid field demarcation, not to prevent a game official from correcting an obvious error.

For that matter, TELL the players and coaches to wipe them out prior to the pregame meeting. They will enjoy it AND get a point across to the ground crew.

[tcblue13]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

The rule is to prevent participants from obliterating valid field demarcation, not to prevent a game official from correcting an obvious error.

For that matter, TELL the players and coaches to wipe them out prior to the pregame meeting. They will enjoy it AND get a point across to the ground crew.

Mike,
You are correct about the intent of the rule. It was instituted in 2005 to prevent the slap hitters from wiping the front of the box out. The batters box extends 4' from the break of the plate toward the circle. That is usually plenty of room for a slap hitter.

But, there are specific penalties in Fed ball for wiping out lines. It is a clearly defined violation of the rules to do so. I would NEVER encourage a player to break the rules of the game. It's just not a good practice even if the lines are drawn incorrectly. As a matter of fact, I can guage the correct position of the line by the placement of misdrawn line.

[AtlUmpSteve]

My vote is to say to home management "This is an area game, and we will need the boxes drawn correctly." Do this on your field walk at least 30 minutes prior to game time, and it gives the field crew plenty of opportunity to redo it without embarassment or assumption of an intentional home field advantage. If necessary, supervise, or indicate the issue with the current lines.

If they don't, then make an issue of it at your pregame, and REQUIRE a legally marked field before starting the game.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by tcblue13

But, there are specific penalties in Fed ball for wiping out lines. It is a clearly defined violation of the rules to do so. I would NEVER encourage a player to break the rules of the game. It's just not a good practice even if the lines are drawn incorrectly. As a matter of fact, I can guage the correct position of the line by the placement of misdrawn line.

Okay, NFHS 1.1.9 specifically instructs the umpire to address an incorrect batter's box by correcting it immediately upon being brought to the umpires attention.

So, the option is correct it once the game starts (as 1.1.9 directs) or as a preventive measure, have it done prior to the game starting. I wouldn't start a game knowing something is amiss without addressing it and my method of correcting improperly drawn BB is to just eliminate it. The lines are there for the teams, not the umpires and I can pretty much guarantee you (the umpire) are better off with no lines than an incorrect BB.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by tcblue13

...But, there are specific penalties in Fed ball for wiping out lines. It is a clearly defined violation of the rules to do so. I would NEVER encourage a player to break the rules of the game. It's just not a good practice even if the lines are drawn incorrectly. As a matter of fact, I can guage the correct position of the line by the placement of misdrawn line.

IMO, you are picking and choosing which rule you will allow to be violated here. The rules specify the size and placement of the batter's box lines (and other lines) on the field. The rules also specify that the umpire is to see that incorrectly drawn lines be corrected. If it is not feasible to have correct lines drawn, then instructing that the incorrectly drawn lines be "erased" is a means of correcting the error, not instructing the players to violate the rules. If you want to get completely anal about this, the rule prohibits team personnel from intentionally removing any lines of the batter’s box, but the incorrectly drawn lines are not a legal batter's box as confirmed by the umpire, so where is the violation?

[argodad]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Okay, NFHS 1.1.9 specifically instructs the umpire to address an incorrect batter's box by correcting it immediately upon being brought to the umpires attention.

So, the option is correct it once the game starts (as 1.1.9 directs) or as a preventive measure, have it done prior to the game starting. I wouldn't start a game knowing something is amiss without addressing it and my method of correcting improperly drawn BB is to just eliminate it. The lines are there for the teams, not the umpires and I can pretty much guarantee you (the umpire) are better off with no lines than an incorrect BB.

I find that many of HS batter's boxes are a couple inches short in the front. For some reason, the "grounds crew" wants to make the front edge of the box square with the foul line, when in fact, the outside corner should be about 4.5" into fair territory. Before the plate meeting, I used my size 14s (when I still had two of them), to drag the chalk out to where it needed to be.