Handling the ball in dead ball territory

[Andy]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

ASA answers needed, but open to answers for other rule sets.

From another forum:



So the fielder jumped over the fence into DBT, grabs the ground ball and throws it back in.

What say you all?

I say ASA 8-5-K.

ASA 8-5-K is right on point....fielder threw a live ball while standing in dead ball territory.

NFHS is a bit more tricky...5-1-1i(b) defines the action, the dead ball table shows the penalty - Award all runners one base from the time the ball became dead, except when the caught ball is the third out.

I suppose that last part is referring to a catch and carry situation.

[KJUmp]

Originally Posted by Andy

ASA 8-5-K is right on point....fielder threw a live ball while standing in dead ball territory.

NFHS is a bit more tricky...5-1-1i(b) defines the action, the dead ball table shows the penalty - Award all runners one base from the time the ball became dead, except when the caught ball is the third out.

I suppose that last part is referring to a catch and carry situation.

Not totally on point. 8-5-K reads: "When in the judgement of the umpire, a fielder intentionally carries, kicks, pushes or throws a live ball from live ball territory."

The sitch in the OP has the fielder in dead ball territory, picking up a ball in live ball territory. But like NCAA 12.13, while not a "perfect fit", 8-5-K could work, absent any other pertinent ASA rule.
Effect would still be an award of two bases for all runners from the last base touched at the time the player in DBT touched the ball in LBT?

[IRISHMAFIA]

I, too, have a problem with the "intentional" portion since the player did not take the ball out of play intentionally. Yet, based upon the interpretation provided last year by KR, I have no problem with the 2 bases.

With no outs and R1 on 2B, B2 hits a line drive to F7. R1 is off on the hit and headed toward 3B when F7 misses the sinking line drive and knocks the ball forward on the ground in front of him. While running in and trying to scoop up the ball, F7 kicks the ball into the 3B dugout. When the ball entered the 3B dugout, R1 is two steps from 3B and B2 is not yet to 1B. Which bases should R1 and B2 be awarded? RULING: R1 is awarded home and B2 is awarded 2B. The ball being kicked into dead ball territory would be treated the same as if F7 threw the ball into dead ball territory. Each runner would be awarded two bases from the time the ball left F7’s foot. (Rule 8, Section 5G)

[Andy]

Originally Posted by KJUmp

Not totally on point. 8-5-K reads: "When in the judgement of the umpire, a fielder intentionally carries, kicks, pushes or throws a live ball from live ball territory."

The sitch in the OP has the fielder in dead ball territory, picking up a ball in live ball territory. But like NCAA 12.13, while not a "perfect fit", 8-5-K could work, absent any other pertinent ASA rule.
Effect would still be an award of two bases for all runners from the last base touched at the time the player in DBT touched the ball in LBT?

Now we are back to grammar and semantics....the way this is written the verbs carries, kicks, pushes, and throws are all seperate acts. You could remove any of them from the sentence and it would still be a valid statement.

...a fielder intentionally throws a live ball from DBT....

Looks to me that is exactly what happened here.

[Andy]

Never mind....reading to quickly again and only seeing what I want to see....