Illegal pitch mechanic

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

a blowhard, then I guess that's what I am.

Nice to know we both agree on something.

[scottk_61]

Originally Posted by fiasco

Nice to know we both agree on something.

You know, if you work basketball games the same way you represent yourself here, I would hate to work 2 or 3 whistle with you.

You need to take a step back, think about how you are talking and reattempt to learn.

I worked basketball before I ever did softball and you sound somewhat typical, over-officious and resentful if someone brings a point forward that you missed.

I can say this, because I was like that too.

You reacted poorly to a statement that the illegal pitch mechanic is umpiring 101, well it is.
Whether you like it or not, it is basic. Don't feel put upon if some people expect you to know it asap.
I think of it a bit like knowing whether to have a open hand or a closed fist up when you blow your whistle. Violation or foul?
You need to know before you walk out on the floor.

However, if you are learning this on your own, Congrats.
I encourage you to get an umpire rulebook, casebook etc from ASA.
Find you local commish through ASA's website if you need to.
You should have been given one if you registered ASA and if not, email Irish and he will help you out.

Hope this helps a bit.
If I can be of any help, message me privately though the board.
I love seeing new officials work out the kinks in their game and advance.
Especially since my Dr. worn't let me work anymore games until I get this da** aneurysm repaired.

[fiasco]

Originally Posted by scottk_61

You know, if you work basketball games the same way you represent yourself here, I would hate to work 2 or 3 whistle with you.

You need to take a step back, think about how you are talking and reattempt to learn.

I worked basketball before I ever did softball and you sound somewhat typical, over-officious and resentful if someone brings a point forward that you missed.

I can say this, because I was like that too.

You reacted poorly to a statement that the illegal pitch mechanic is umpiring 101, well it is.
Whether you like it or not, it is basic. Don't feel put upon if some people expect you to know it asap.
I think of it a bit like knowing whether to have a open hand or a closed fist up when you blow your whistle. Violation or foul?
You need to know before you walk out on the floor.

However, if you are learning this on your own, Congrats.
I encourage you to get an umpire rulebook, casebook etc from ASA.
Find you local commish through ASA's website if you need to.
You should have been given one if you registered ASA and if not, email Irish and he will help you out.

Hope this helps a bit.
If I can be of any help, message me privately though the board.
I love seeing new officials work out the kinks in their game and advance.
Especially since my Dr. worn't let me work anymore games until I get this da** aneurysm repaired.

If a new official comes to me and asks me the difference between an open and closed fist, I don't tell him "Well, that's officiating 101" and walk away, whether I intend to be or not, I'm a jackass for doing that. I'm not being a teacher, I'm being a high-horse jackass, and I have no problem treating someone as a jackass as a result.

Could I have misinterpreted Mike's intent? Sure. But he gave me no indication other than to believe he's on his umpire high horse, givin' a good, old-fashioned talkin' to to a newbie who doesn't know his stuff. Which is fine.

I don't take offense to being told, in a respectful manner, that what I'm doing is wrong, or I look like a buffoon, or I don't know my rules. It's happened many times over the course of my career.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by fiasco

If a new official comes to me and asks me the difference between an open and closed fist, I don't tell him "Well, that's officiating 101" and walk away, whether I intend to be or not, I'm a jackass for doing that. I'm not being a teacher, I'm being a high-horse jackass, and I have no problem treating someone as a jackass as a result.

Could I have misinterpreted Mike's intent? Sure. But he gave me no indication other than to believe he's on his umpire high horse, givin' a good, old-fashioned talkin' to to a newbie who doesn't know his stuff. Which is fine.

I don't take offense to being told, in a respectful manner, that what I'm doing is wrong, or I look like a buffoon, or I don't know my rules. It's happened many times over the course of my career.

Well, relax. Mike means no harm.

I think I had a similar reaction to Mike when I first came here, but then I got to know him better. Trust me, just let it go, stick around, and enjoy yourself here. No one here is out to getcha.

[scottk_61]

Originally Posted by fiasco

Could I have misinterpreted Mike's intent? Sure. But he gave me no indication other than to believe he's on his umpire high horse, givin' a good, old-fashioned talkin' to to a newbie who doesn't know his stuff. Which is fine.

I don't take offense to being told, in a respectful manner, that what I'm doing is wrong, or I look like a buffoon, or I don't know my rules. It's happened many times over the course of my career.

I really don't think Mike hit you too hard, he is known to be patient but firm.
I have known Mike online for a number of years, and it has been more than a few years since I have seen him in person.
He is a class act and someone I would certainly defer to on the rules of the game and for ASA mechanics.

I have never known Mike to dress anyone down unless it was richly deserved such as with a troll or a pretender, ie someone who said that they were something they weren't in umpiring.

I, myself and myself alone, read you as someone who was digging for a debate or small ball arguement. I apologize for my mis-understanding of you and who you are.

Now, if I blow up and holler at you. It is because I have very little to no tolerance for and umpire or referee making a call that they cannot explain, or for not knowing the rule from which a call should come.

Learn your rules, be patient with people like me.
It is hot, the summer makes everyone crazy.
Work your game of softball with a real intensity that is equal to what you do in basketball. You and I both know that watching 10 players, partner or partners and the ball is difficult.
Work with that same kind of awareness, being knowledgeable with the rules and casebook and you can work any level.

Sorry if we misread you and just be patient with those of us who were sceptical.

Those who have been around take offense not so much at you but at an association who would leave you hanging in the wind with no good training or instruction.

See if you can find a knowledgeable person locally to use as your mentor or at least find someone who is putting forth effort so that you can bounce ideas and questions off of.

Keep plugging away, the game gets better.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by scottk_61

See if you can find a knowledgeable person locally to use as your mentor or at least find someone who is putting forth effort so that you can bounce ideas and questions off of.

And a bit of advice you may already know: it's not always the "old veteran" who knows best. I had a "20-year vet" tell me that a runner leading off on the pitch is an appeal play in slow pitch.

Pick your mentors carefully.

[scottk_61]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

And a bit of advice you may already know: it's not always the "old veteran" who knows best. I had a "20-year vet" tell me that a runner leading off on the pitch is an appeal play in slow pitch.

Pick your mentors carefully.

Amen to that, I once had an old crusty vet tell a partner (3 man) that he had to call the infield fly when we had runners on 1st and 3rd and that a coach was immediatly ejected if the coach came out with a rulebook to ask a question. The old guys swore these things were in the rulebook.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by scottk_61

Amen to that, I once had an old crusty vet tell a partner (3 man) that he had to call the infield fly when we had runners on 1st and 3rd and that a coach was immediatly ejected if the coach came out with a rulebook to ask a question. The old guys swore these things were in the rulebook.

They may have been, just not the one we use for softball

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by scottk_61

He is a class act...

Are you sure you want to take it that far???????

[scottk_61]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

Are you sure you want to take it that far???????

Shh, I was sucking up.
I might need something from him one day.

[wadeintothem]

I would suggest not calling an IP.

I mean this in all seriousness. If you dont know what you are calling or how to call it and havent received training on what you are looking for and why - certainly as to intent and spirit, you should not be calling it.

What is it you would be calling that you couldnt resolve in some other way?

One of the worst things an umpire can do is read a sentence in the rule book then run out that day looking for that violation so they can practice enforcing it.

If you are PU - normally in rec league they do things like step on the pitchers plate with their hands together. Just tell em.

If you are bu and they are stepping off the plate, during a lull, go up, clean the Pitchers plate, and tell her, "toe up girl, you gotta touch the plate with both feet".

If you do call it, call it early, with no runners on. Dont wait until the 5th inning with bases loaded to figure out you are going to finally call it.

Its an instructional recreational league, not a competitive travel tournament. 90% will never play a travel tournament - they just want to play.

Let them play ball.

Especially until you receive training.

There are more to IP's than throwing your arm out.

If at all possible, work it in someother way other than simply making calls. Picking boogers and looking for trouble; well you will find it.

If you do call it, call it early, with no runners on. Dont wait until the 5th inning with bases loaded to figure out you are going to finally call it.

Its an instructional recreational league, not a competitive travel tournament. 90% will never play a travel tournament - they just want to play... so let let them play ball.

Especially until you receive training.

There are more to IP's that throwing your arm out and awards balls and bases.

Dont be suprised if several umps disagree with me, on this... but at this point, unless some significant thing is happening like some walking crow hop or are gaining some other big advantage - let it go or figure out another way to deal with it. You dont have the training nor forum for a lot of IP enforcement.