Rookie Question

[Umpteenth]

Rookie here, not ashamed to admit it. Glad I found this forum; I read frequently and only want to improve my skills. Which leads to my situation tonight. ASA, Men's SP, Wreck league. I'm BU.

Visitor at bat, 1 out, R1 on 2nd, R2 on 1st. B4 hits fly ball to center field, which is caught for 2nd out, R1 left 2nd early and advanced to 3rd, R2 advanced to 2nd. After my partner called time and the ball is dead, D3 says to me, Blue did he leave early? I banged R1 for 3rd out, as he did leave early.

Offensive coach then complained that a proper appeal had not been made. Admittedly, the defensive player did not state, "I want to appeal" and did not use the word appeal. Rule 8 7 F states, the runner is out "When a runner leaves a base to advance to another base before a caught fly ball has touched a fielder, providing the ball is returned to the infield and properly appealed." This requirement was met.
Effect 3 states: "(Dead Ball Appeal) Once the ball has been returned to the infield and time is called, any infielder with or without possession of the ball may make a verbal appeal on a runner missing a base or leaving a base too soon on a caught fly ball. No runner may leave a base during this period as the ball remains dead until the next pitch." I feel this requirement was met.

My partner and I discussed the call and he agreed that R1 had left early, and therefore the out remained.

I feel I made the right call, but I ask myself now, was the play "properly appealed"? There was no other play made, time had been called. There was no throw back to 2nd base, which is not required. So, on an appeal, does the player have to state, "I want to appeal"? I'm not finding in the rule book about making a "proper appeal".

After the game, the Offensive coach agreed that the call would not have affected the outcome of the game, but still insisted a proper appeal had not been made. I won't lose sleep over this, but I want to learn it and avoid similar situations. As I've learned from reading here, it's all about preventive umpiring.

[AtlUmpSteve]

You handled it properly. The ball was dead, a verbal appeal was made by an infielder. Doesn't require the words "I appeal"; it was clear to you it was an appeal, it was clear to you who and what was being appealed. You ruled on it; that's correct.

[Ed Maeder]

No problem with the appeal. The only problem I see is that R1 was the plate umpires responsibility, you were responsible for R2.

[wadeintothem]

Welcome to the site!

I have the solution!

Quit talking to the coaches at the end of the game and you wont have these concerns.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Umpteenth

After the game, the Offensive coach agreed that the call would not have affected the outcome of the game, but still insisted a proper appeal had not been made. I won't lose sleep over this, but I want to learn it and avoid similar situations. As I've learned from reading here, it's all about preventive umpiring.

As already noted, you handled the entire situation correctly. Should you happen upon this OC again and the same issue arises, simply ask the coach to show you where in the rule book they list the acceptable verbiage for a proper appeal. It's usually right next to the rule requiring players to wear gloves

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Ed Maeder

No problem with the appeal. The only problem I see is that R1 was the plate umpires responsibility, you were responsible for R2.

You beat me to it.

Speaking ASA (and that can make a difference)...

PU always has tag-ups on a runner on 3B.
BU always has tag-ups on a runner on 1B.
If there's a lone runner on 2B, that's the BU's call, and he follows the runner to 3B if he attempts to advance (unless the ball wasn't caught).
If there are multiple runners, PU has the lead runner, and BU has everyone else.

I agree with everyone else here that the appeal was proper. In this sitch, I would've called time and informed the PU that F3 (I'm assuming you're referring to the first baseman) had asked if R1 left early.

Welcome to the forum!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

You beat me to it.

Speaking ASA (and that can make a difference)...

PU always has tag-ups on a runner on 3B.
BU always has tag-ups on a runner on 1B.
If there's a lone runner on 2B, that's the BU's call, and he follows the runner to 3B if he attempts to advance (unless the ball wasn't caught).
If there are multiple runners, PU has the lead runner, and BU has everyone else.

I agree with everyone else here that the appeal was proper. In this sitch, I would've called time and informed the PU that F3 (I'm assuming you're referring to the first baseman) had asked if R1 left early.

Everything Ed and Dave stated is absolutely correct, especially for a rookie umpire and that should be taken into consideration.

However, I am not aware of a veteran who is looking through the runner (ball and play) for the touch who would not take that call. I'm not referring to a guess or maybe, but a blatant early jump.

[Tru_in_Blu]

D3 says to me, Blue did he leave early? I banged R1 for 3rd out, as he did leave early.

As mentioned in earlier posts, the runner at second base in this situation was the PU's responsibility. Had I been the base umpire, I would have required more clarity. "Did he leave early?" does not specifiy which runner the defense is appealing.

If they clarified that they were appealing the runner leaving from 2B, the proper mechanic would be to ask the PU for his ruling.

This exact scenario happened to me recently. Both runners were safe, but my BU poached the call on the runner from 2B. Between innings, he claimed that he thought they were appealing the runner from 1B. Regardless, he wasn't clear on what the defense was appealing and decided to just jump in everywhere. It got a bit annoying when he told me he's been "doing this for L years". I figured that after that long, he should have been able to get it right.

Ted

[TwoBits]

Originally Posted by Umpteenth

Rookie here, not ashamed to admit it. Glad I found this forum; I read frequently and only want to improve my skills. Which leads to my situation tonight. ASA, Men's SP, Wreck league.

At least you've got the terminology for this level of play correct.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu

... he told me he's been "doing this for L years"...

What was he? A character from the Wizard of Id? He speaks in Roman Numerals?

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Dakota

What was he? A character from the Wizard of Id? He speaks in Roman Numerals?

Nah, I think he was just confused. His partner was speaking bad Spanish.

[Umpteenth]

Originally Posted by TwoBits

At least you've got the terminology for this level of play correct.

Just proves that I have been reading this site, cuz that term sure fits!

Thanks for the replies. I can see improvements to some of the details in the way I handled this (again, thinking preventive and not reactive, and making sure he was referring to R1 [as I recall he pointed to the runner in question, so it was clear, but could have been verbalized]), but most important is making the right call.

I'll review the mechanics section for ASA 2 umpire system. The first games I worked this season, my partners stressed that PU had 1st and 3rd on tag-ups and BU had 2nd. My book is at home, so I'll read that later.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by Umpteenth

Just proves that I have been reading this site, cuz that term sure fits!

We like you already!

Originally Posted by Umpteenth

Thanks for the replies. I can see improvements to some of the details in the way I handled this (again, thinking preventive and not reactive, and making sure he was referring to R1 [as I recall he pointed to the runner in question, so it was clear, but could have been verbalized]), but most important is making the right call.

In that case, yeah, it's clear that the infielder is properly appealing a specific runner.

Originally Posted by Umpteenth

I'll review the mechanics section for ASA 2 umpire system. The first games I worked this season, my partners stressed that PU had 1st and 3rd on tag-ups and BU had 2nd. My book is at home, so I'll read that later.

According to the strict letter of ASA, your partners were wrong. The book on page 253 says...

THE PLATE UMPIRE has tag responsibilities under the following situations:
1. All runners at third base.
2. The runner at Second Base with runners at first and Second Base.
THE BASE UMPIRE has tag responsibilities under the following situations:
1. All runners at First Base.
2. The runner at Second Base with runners at second and third bases or Sec-
ond Base only.
3. Runners at first and Second Base when the bases are full.

[NCASAUmp]

To add a little clarification to my previous post (that I was going to provide until my boss came in and wanted to work on a project - damn work!), there is a note after my quoted section...

NOTE: These tag-up procedures should be followed at all times, UNLESS there is COMMUNICATION between both umpires. These responsibilities are covered in the duties listed on the following pages.

The caps were not done by me, they were done by ASA. We can't emphasize enough that umpires need to communicate before, during and after the game. If you pregame this kind of deviation, you shouldn't run into problems with double-calls.

ASA is a little rigid when it comes to mechanics and responsibilities. As such, deviations from said mechanics and responsibilities. However, when you have tens of thousands of registered umpires across the US that need to be trained from the ground up, a little rigidity is to be expected.

But that's a whole 'nother debate we won't get into. My only goal here is to relay what the book says.

[Dakota]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

...According to the strict letter of ASA, your partners were wrong. The book on page 253 says...

As the new guy, he should probably go with the local mechanic (at least for now).

ASA is excessively wordy:
Plate Umpire has tag up responsibility for
1) Runner at 3B
2) Lead runner with multiple runners on

Base Umpire has tag up responsibility for
1) All others