ASA Rule; Access to,

[topper]

Originally Posted by bkbjones

IMHO, no matter where they are located, umpires working for other softball organizations should not openly expect assignments to ASA championship play.

Does the term "independent contractor" mean anything to you? What would compel someone to pass up $35-$40/game to work for $25/game? Loyalty? The opportunity to take a week's vacation and travel to an ASA natiional to work for $18-$20? Wake up and smell the cost of living.

[SethPDX]

Originally Posted by topper

Does the term "independent contractor" mean anything to you? What would compel someone to pass up $35-$40/game to work for $25/game? Loyalty? The opportunity to take a week's vacation and travel to an ASA natiional to work for $18-$20? Wake up and smell the cost of living.

Well, there is the matter of being able to say you worked an ASA national. There is more to umpiring than money, you know.

You can go work wherever you want; just don't expect an organization to give you the best assignments if you do not contribute to that organization when needed.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by topper

Does the term "independent contractor" mean anything to you? What would compel someone to pass up $35-$40/game to work for $25/game? Loyalty? The opportunity to take a week's vacation and travel to an ASA natiional to work for $18-$20? Wake up and smell the cost of living.

Some of us are more BLUE than GREEN. I would venture to say that most of us on this board actually work to get to the big tournament and game. Many are thrilled to get the nod because of our effort and work ethics, not necessarily because of longevity and/or availability.

Many of us would do it for nothing and I'm sure some on this board have been there and done that.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Some of us are more BLUE than GREEN. I would venture to say that most of us on this board actually work to get to the big tournament and game. Many are thrilled to get the nod because of our effort and work ethics, not necessarily because of longevity and/or availability.

Many of us would do it for nothing and I'm sure some on this board have been there and done that.

I just work to have fun. I want to be the best, yes, but I don't care about the money or the big game.

[PtotheB]

I have always chosen hobbies that have challenged me in one way or another. When I was in Alaska I earned my private pilots license. It was a very challenging but very expensive hobby. Officiating is also challenging if approached the right way but it also happens to pay for gas. Would I do it for free? Probably, at least to some extent but not as much as I do now.

[NCASAUmp]

I'm going to say what I'm positive others are thinking.

Would I do it for free? Hell no. Put up with whiney players (adult league) or obnoxious parents (youth... and adult league) without something for my efforts? Not on your life.

Is it about the money? No. Don't confuse "wanting a little something for my troubles" with "money, money, money." Gas prices are high. I have a mortgage. I'm away from my wife.

Have I or would I volunteer now and then? Absolutely. My first 4 years behind the plate were actually spent volunteering for local kids' games - kids that could otherwise be hanging around in the streets and getting into trouble. I certainly enjoy calling ball, and if the group is a good group, I'll gladly do it.

But if my assignor asked me to call ball for free for a month, I'd tell him he's nucking futs!

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by NCASAUmp

I'm away from my wife.

First off, I want to know what this has to do with needing money?

Second, you are not reading the posts. The issue was raised over making more money working a local game or less working an ASA national.

Again, no where was it suggested anyone umpire for free, in general.

[Dholloway1962]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Many of us would do it for nothing

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

I just work to have fun. but I don't care about the money

I gotta call BS on these quotes guys. Thinking back on your umpiring career, take away the money you were paid and you would do this for free? It has to do a little with the $$$. To practice what you preach, I suggest you do an entire year for free, no cash payments or reimbursements of any kind, including paying for your food/drink at the concessions.

I am into this (umpiring) for more than the money, but the money is part of it. It has to be and to insinuate the money doesn't matter is not quite truthful.

[NCASAUmp]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

First off, I want to know what this has to do with needing money?

If I'm gonna be away from her, I'd better be bringing home the bacon!

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Second, you are not reading the posts. The issue was raised over making more money working a local game or less working an ASA national.

Again, no where was it suggested anyone umpire for free, in general.

Yeah, I guess I kinda missed that part, didn't I? I just saw a number of recent posts that said, "I don't do it for the money... I don't do it for the money..." I know a lot of us feel that way, but I can't believe every umpire that says that.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally Posted by Skahtboi

I just work to have fun. I want to be the best, yes, but I don't care about the money or the big game.

I agree. I enjoy the umpiring. I will and have done it for nothing. I don't
live close to any of the games I call. Wanting the big game, they all are
big games.

[Steve M]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Some of us are more BLUE than GREEN. I would venture to say that most of us on this board actually work to get to the big tournament and game. Many are thrilled to get the nod because of our effort and work ethics, not necessarily because of longevity and/or availability.

Many of us would do it for nothing and I'm sure some on this board have been there and done that.

Money is an enticemnt, certainly. But if all I wanted was the income, I'd be doing something else, 'cuz I'd be making a whole lot more than I do on a ball field. I don't know that I need the BIG game, I think I've done enough of those. I do, however, want to be part of a game where good ball is played - and all "local" games (within my district) are much more of a recreation level of play. So I travel and work the best games I can - some of that is ASA, some of that is ISC, and the rest are under another sanctioning body. If there were a lot of quality ball in my area, I'd be content to stay local - but there isn't. The same district commissioner who doesn't care to send any umpires to a national thinks that recreation level ball is the only level he wants to run tournaments for.

[Skahtboi]

Originally Posted by Steve M

Money is an enticemnt, certainly. But if all I wanted was the income, I'd be doing something else, 'cuz I'd be making a whole lot more than I do on a ball field. I don't know that I need the BIG game, I think I've done enough of those. I do, however, want to be part of a game where good ball is played - and all "local" games (within my district) are much more of a recreation level of play. So I travel and work the best games I can - some of that is ASA, some of that is ISC, and the rest are under another sanctioning body. If there were a lot of quality ball in my area, I'd be content to stay local - but there isn't. The same district commissioner who doesn't care to send any umpires to a national thinks that recreation level ball is the only level he wants to run tournaments for.

Exactly!!!

[Dholloway1962]

Scott, I do know where you are coming from, trust me. I just get tired of umpires saying they would do it for free, or the money doesn't matter. Of course it does, you even admit you need the money to keep up with equipment, gas, etc... Would you do it for free, no compensation at all? I imagine the answer is no. So the money is part of the reason for doing it. If you would do it for totally nothing then I suggest you see a doctor

I love the game and I love umping the game. Am I in it for the money, partly. Take the money out of it would I do it, absolutely not!

[wadeintothem]

I think as independent contractors, umpires are free to roam where they may, putting to work the training they pay and work for as they see fit.

I think an organization that hires umpires can set their criteria... and it is perfectly reasonable to set criteria for assignment which could/should include loyalty.

i.e. If you are primarily an NSA umpire who leaves an ASA assigner hanging week after week for the "regular tournaments", but a cool 18G ASA NQ rolls in, so suddenly you call up and are available .. well if would be perfectly fine for that assigner to put you at the bottom of the list or even black ball you. Yeah, we may use you.. at 12U. Theres your assignment pal, enjoy it.

I think its fair for both sides to operate in this manner, that is the nature of independent contracting, and one has a choice they can make with the understanding that loyalty to an organization is a perfectly valid criteria for evaluation of an umpire as a whole in regards to assignments.

[bkbjones]

Originally Posted by topper

Does the term "independent contractor" mean anything to you? What would compel someone to pass up $35-$40/game to work for $25/game? Loyalty? The opportunity to take a week's vacation and travel to an ASA natiional to work for $18-$20? Wake up and smell the cost of living.

You're asking ME to wake up and smell the cost of living? Oh, if you only knew. Since August of 2006 I have not been able to work more than five hours a day at my "real" job due to health reasons. Since April 1, I have been unable to work my "real" job at all. I am not going to get into all the reasons why, but that is beside the point.

Oh, that other waking up and smelling the cost of living? Medical expenses, including visiting up to four different makes of doctors every month and getting the prescriptions, costs about $1,000 a month. It would cost more, but my wife has decent insurance. Also I have chosen to ignore a couple of health concerns which I really shouldn't ignore, but life is made of choices. Ignoring them will very likely shorten my life, but, hey, just think what a difference slowly dying makes on the cost of living!

Obviously loyalty doesn't mean as much to you as it does to me and many others. If that is a "fault" in your eyes, I feel sorry for you. If you are in it for the money, please quit now and go cook fries at McDonalds, work at 7-11 or something else. You will make far more money (net profit) at Mickey D's than you ever will umpiring. You might not make as many friends for life at Mickey D's, but, heck, you'll be much better off in regards to the cost of living.

Oh, and that week's vacation to work a national for $18 a game? Well, I was supposed to go to Illinois in 2007 for a week's vacation and get that $18 a game, but things just didn't work out. However, I'd do it in a heartbeat -- and Thank God there are thousands of others who feel the very same.