Removing helmet on base.

[Time_Blue]

During the world cup a player was called out for removing her helmet after the play was over. ASA rules say.... descretion by the umpire should be used in calling her out. Are the ISF rules different from ASA. I agree with the announcers. ....that was a picky call.

[wadeintothem]

Originally Posted by Time_Blue

During the world cup a player was called out for removing her helmet after the play was over. ASA rules say.... descretion by the umpire should be used in calling her out. Are the ISF rules different from ASA. I agree with the announcers. ....that was a picky call.

Probably is a picky rule (i'm not familiar with the ISF rules) .. but in anycase, when you are playing at the level, those calls are going to be made. If the rules read the runner is out, its an out.. and it would be difficult for an umpire to say "im not going to enforce that rule". I doubt the umpire liked making the call, but it would have to be made.

also, if a rule, very bone headed by the runner.

[debeau]

ISF state simply the runner will be called out on a live ball play if the helmet was removed deliberatley .
I saw this and thought it was a crap out as there was no play on the runner .
The coach could well have had a grounds for a protest , but then most coaches think removeing the helmet at any time is an out .

[CecilOne]

If the rule says "live ball play" and "play was over" means dead ball, is it then a wrong call?

[mcrowder]

"Play was over" doesn't mean dead ball unless you're playing slowpitch or an umpire actually calls "Time!"

[tcblue13]

If we define play like we do on LBR, then something has to be happening on the field such as the D throwing the ball to the fielder closest to the play. Absent this, there is really not a live ball play.

If R1 is stopped on 3B and the ball is thrown leisurly to F4 from F9 as there is no play at first or third and R1 is obviously not attempting to go home. As R1 is standing on the bag, she sees the "non urgency" of the action and takes off her helmet to fix her hair and to pull up her socks. For no reason, F4 rifles the ball to F5 and conks R1 in the head. That might be considered a live ball play even though the assumption would be that F4 would throw the ball to F1. Maybe F4 is fishing for that out. Would USC would be out of the question on F4 since there was no real reason to throw the ball to F5?? I doubt it because the D can throw the ball around if they want as long as they don't unnecessarily delay the game.
Just thinking at the keyboard

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by mcrowder

"Play was over" doesn't mean dead ball unless you're playing slowpitch or an umpire actually calls "Time!"

I was asking about his sitch description, not the rule.

[mcrowder]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

I was asking about his sitch description, not the rule.

Ah. I would assume that in a game at this high a level, if the ball was in fact dead when this out was called, then either of the other two umpires would have fixed the situation, and failing that the manager SURELY would have protested. I think it's safe to say the ball wasn't dead.

[debeau]

In this case ball was alive but no play .
Again this was a crap play and again surprised me no protest was forthcomeing .
If anyone else saw and understood this call please explain .
Please note rules for this do not differ from ASA and ISF

[AtlUmpSteve]

This wouldn't be the first time you saw someone reach a big tournament and tried to justify their presence by finding something to call, would it?

[debeau]

Wellllllll !
Yes I suppose umpireing is the same the world over and personalities are cloned also .

[SWFLguy]

I was a bit amazed at the call.
The umpire that made it was "looking for things".
Officials like that should not be working at high levels !
Just my 2¢ !!

[IRISHMAFIA]

LBR and the parameters surrounding that rule have nothing to do with this.

[Antonella]

Rule 3 - EQUIPMENT
Sec.6: PROTECTIVE EQUIPMENT
f. Helmet
(...)
2) Deliberately wearing the helmet improperly or deliberately removing the helmet during a live
ball play, except on a home run hit over the fence, and seen by the umpire as a deliberate act shall
cause the violator to be declared out immediately. The ball remains live.
EXCEPTION 6-f-2: If a thrown or batted ball contacts the deliberately removed helmet, the ball becomes dead and
runners must return to the last base held at the time of such contact.
NOTE: Calling a runner out for removing a helmet deliberately does not cancel any force play situation.

This is ISF.
See what? You cannot find this ruling under Rule 8.
Nothing like 'Runner is out when...'

That do MEANS something to me.

Ciao

[tcannizzo]

I could understand if this was youth ball, but I don't see why this rule has to exist at the adult level. They can wear jewlery, don't have to wear face masks or chin straps. What's up with this one?