Batter hit after swing

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Dakota

Hawkeye, first of all, you cannot compare NFHS anything with general amateur rule books in matters dealing with USC and misbehavior. Generic amateur rule books (and their associated interpretation publications) deal with everything from little kids to adults. NFHS deals exclusively with school children. That difference is not just in matters of age; it is also in the school's role of in loco parentis. The NFHS softball rule book goes into more detail on USC and behavior issues than does the ASA rule book, but from what you are saying, still probably waaaaayyy less detail than the NFHS football book.

Having said all of that, two things... the frequency of grammatical, word usage, and syntax errors in ASA publications is a matter of somewhat regular discussion here. Hang around.

Second, the ASA rules interpretations publications (Case Book, POEs, clinic teaching material, umpire manual, etc.) are light years ahead of the NFHS Softball publications in terms of both detailed rulings and depth of situations covered. The NFHS POEs are particularly meager to the point of complete uselessness.

Also, as far as other sports go, there is much more close contact between players in BB and FB, also much more fan "contact"; so more detailed descriptions are needed. Sports like golf and tennis require less; and the descriptions for soccer ar much broader.

[HawkeyeCubP]

Good discussion and info everyone. Thanks Mike, Cecil, Dakota. I had considered many of the things brought up.

And I do plan on hanging around for at least another decade or so, if possible.

[rwest]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Last year at the Hooters, in his clinic, Bernie went over a few rules including the old standard about a runner leaving 1B early and being between 2B & 3B when the outfielder releases the ball which goes out of play and the bases awarded. Out of the 15 Elite umpires, only one got it right. Even after reviewing the different possible answers, only one stood on the initial correct response. Happy to say, that umpire frequents this board daily.

This seems simple to me. Am I missing something obvious? You award the runner home on the overthrow, but the runner must complete his baserunning responsibilities by returning to touch 1b, and touching second both on his way back and on his way to third and home.

This brings up a few questions.

Do you wait a few seconds to see if the runner returns to 1st before awarding home? If so, isn't that giving away something? Or do you just award the runner the 2 bases and watch to see if he returns?

Also, once a runner has advanced to the next awarded base, they can not return to touch a missed base or a base left too soon. So what if they do return even when by rule they can't? Do you say anything or just remain quiet? Since they are not allowed to return, the appeal is still on. I believe if I say something that would be giving the defense an advantage.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by rwest

This seems simple to me. Am I missing something obvious? You award the runner home on the overthrow, but the runner must complete his baserunning responsibilities by returning to touch 1b, and touching second both on his way back and on his way to third and home.

This brings up a few questions.

Do you wait a few seconds to see if the runner returns to 1st before awarding home? If so, isn't that giving away something? Or do you just award the runner the 2 bases and watch to see if he returns?

Yes, the umpire should wait on any award until you are satisfied the runner has completed what running tasks they choose to. Then you announce the award. Part of the reason is that if the umpire just says, "Dead ball, two bases", the runner is just doing what you, the umpire, told them to do. IOW, there could be a discussion of the umpire placing the runner in jeopardy.

Also, once a runner has advanced to the next awarded base, they can not return to touch a missed base or a base left too soon.

Which is why you hesitate announcing the award.

So what if they do return even when by rule they can't? Do you say anything or just remain quiet? Since they are not allowed to return, the appeal is still on. I believe if I say something that would be giving the defense an advantage.

If this should happen, you allow them to return, but still honor the appeal as if the base were never retouched.