TwoBits ... runner hit while touching base ... dead ball case?

[bobbrix]

Per TwoBits myths:

· The runner is always safe when hit by a batted ball while touching a base.


Is there a case where this is a dead ball?

If the there is a case where it would be a dead ball, would it be a 'no pitch' situation?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by bobbrix

Per TwoBits myths:

· The runner is always safe when hit by a batted ball while touching a base.


Is there a case where this is a dead ball?

Yes, if the runner is hit by the batted ball while in contact with the base before it passes the closest infielder.

If the there is a case where it would be a dead ball, would it be a 'no pitch' situation?

Cannot have a "no pitch" on a ball that has been legaling put into play.

[bobbrix]

Thanks so far, Mike.

What would the ball/strike call be, then, for the dead ball situation?

Batted ball hits R1 while she is standing on 3B and before the ball passes the closest infielder.

Do I have a foul ball?

[UmpireErnie]

Originally Posted by bobbrix

Batted ball hits R1 while she is standing on 3B and before the ball passes the closest infielder.

Do I have a foul ball?

Bobbrix,

Think about the question for a moment. The batted ball touches the runner who is standing on 3B. Where is the ball when it makes contact with a player? Is the ball over fair territory or foul territory?

[SC Ump]

Originally Posted by bobbrix

Batted ball hits R1 while she is standing on 3B and before the ball passes the closest infielder.

This would be a dead ball. The batter would be awarded with a base hit and other runners would advance only if forced.

[bobbrix]

Umpire Ernie: Sorry ... the case was the batted ball struck the runner who was actually standing with both feet on the bag. It was a ground ball that was in fair territory all the way (was either going to hit the bag or bounce over it into left field). The batted ball hit her leg, and both the ball and her leg were in fair territory.

SC Ump: Thanks. I'll search through my rule book again and try to see where they explain that award.

[UmpireErnie]

Originally Posted by bobbrix

Umpire Ernie: Sorry ... the case was the batted ball struck the runner who was actually standing with both feet on the bag. It was a ground ball that was in fair territory all the way (was either going to hit the bag or bounce over it into left field). The batted ball hit her leg, and both the ball and her leg were in fair territory.

OK. The point of my question is that for fair or foul the position of the runner does not matter only the location of the ball.

Now with a runner in contact with a base you are correct we cannot have an out, unless the runner intentionally interferes with the batted ball.

If the cloest fielder other than F1 is in front of the base, so that the ball has passed a fielder before the runner is contacted, then we have a live fair ball, play on. But if the ball has not passed or touched a fielder other than F1 before it touches the runner on base, by rule the ball becomes dead, the batter-runner is awarded 1B (and a single for you scorekeepers out there), and other runners return to the base occupied at time of pitch unless forced by BRs award of 1B.

[bobbrix]

Thanks a heap Ump Ernie

Your answer is now in my notebook.

It seems odd to me that we'd award the offence when one of there runners gets hit by a batted ball, even though she was on base when hit ... but, I understand the rule now. I'll think it over a while.

Regards,

bobbrix

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by UmpireErnie

OK. The point of my question is that for fair or foul the position of the runner does not matter only the location of the ball.

Now with a runner in contact with a base you are correct we cannot have an out, unless the runner intentionally interferes with the batted ball.

If the cloest fielder other than F1 is in front of the base, so that the ball has passed a fielder before the runner is contacted, then we have a live fair ball, play on. But if the ball has not passed or touched a fielder other than F1 before it touches the runner on base, by rule the ball becomes dead, the batter-runner is awarded 1B (and a single for you scorekeepers out there), and other runners return to the base occupied at time of pitch unless forced by BRs award of 1B.

Is the dead ball before passing a fielder criteria just in ASA?

[UmpireErnie]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

Is the dead ball before passing a fielder criteria just in ASA?

No, same thing in other codes as well.

If a runner is hit by a batted ball while ON a base, and the ball is fair, then one of two things happen:

If the ball has not touched a fielder or passed a fielder other than F1 then the ball is dead, nobody is out, and the BR is awarded 1B. Other runners move if forced.

If the ball passed a fielder other than F1 then the umpire must decide if another fielder had a chance to make a play on the ball if the runner had not been hit with the ball. If so then the call is the same as above, dead ball, nobody out, BR to first, runners move if forced.

But if the ball has passed a fielder other than F1 and nobody else had a play on the ball, or if the ball was touched by a fielder before touching the runner, then you have nothing. In this case I give a “safe” signal and say loudly “that’s nothing, play on!” becuase everyone is going to be pretty sure that it is supposed to be something!

Now, what if the runner is off the base? All of the calls are exactly the same, except that in the cases where you would call a dead ball, the runner who was hit will be called out for INT.

[UmpireErnie]

Originally Posted by bobbrix

It seems odd to me that we'd award the offence when one of there runners gets hit by a batted ball, even though she was on base when hit ... but, I understand the rule now. I'll think it over a while.

I believe the intent of the rule is to give the runner somewhere to safely be. Otherwise, the runner would be forced to vacate the base to avoid being hit by the ball which could lead to a cheap out.

[Shmuelg]

Ernie,

Interesting to note that this is different in baseball. Even if the runner is ON base in baseball, he's out.

Well, of course, you see, he doesn't have to remain on base at all, he can move to avoid the ball, but in softball he cannot.