Painting Helmets

[Steve M]

First of all, I don't care what little league, dixie, afa, or any other minor sanctioning body has to say about painted helmets other than if you are playing under their rules - follow their rules.

ASA, Fed, and NCAA do not care about painted helmets - those are the sanctioning bodies that I work under, those are the sanctioning bodies that I care about. I guess I'll be adding PONY to the list of organizations that I care abou, but that's another story.

Now, if a helmet is painted thickly enough that I cannot fully see either the stamp of the warning label, I will ask te coach if the coach wants to scrape the paint off. If yes, I'll look at the helment then. If the coach's answer is "no, I won't scrape the paint off that spot on that helmet", the helmet is not acceptable.

[CecilOne]

Originally posted by Steve M
[ASA, Fed, and NCAA do not care about painted helmets - those are the sanctioning bodies that I work under, those are the sanctioning bodies that I care about. I guess I'll be adding PONY to the list of organizations that I care about, but that's another story.

Welcome to the club, the "horsie" set.

[Rskibum]

Why not request a certificate from Riddell stating that the helmets appearance was "upgraded" at the factory using factory approved materials, etc. ? This puts the burden upon Riddell, and absolves the coaches and umpires.
I'm sure this was not a free service, so they should have no problem doing this if they want to generate more $$$ in the future from you and other teams.
In the interim, carry a copy of your invoice from Riddell showing the work was performed by them.

[Steve M]

Thanks, Cecil.

RSKIBUM -
First - welcome.
Second - An invoice is not going to be good enough. How can I tell that these are the helmets that your invoice is for? Same thing with a certificate. Unless you have something that is very specific in putting the work done on helmets to these specific helments, it's not good enough.

[Rskibum]

Thanks!
Ideally, stamping each helmet with an individual serial number, and reflecting these numbers on a cert.
May be too late for your present batch of helmets.
I know, it's a burden upon the manufacturer, but a means to an end.
They can charge $$ for the service.
I work in an FDA regulated enviroment, where documentation is everything.

Good luck!

[Big_Foot]

I am co owner of a company that paints softball helmets and a Schutt Sports dealer. We use paints that have no effect on the helmet or that strethen the helmet. We work many tourments in our area and apy them for painting at there tournaments. It is big bucks for them. We are sought after by them. We are in high demand by the leagues, tournaments, and have the endorsement of Schutt Sports. WHen we paint helmets we maintain high standards. The main thing is you must use a repitable company to paint your helments.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by DaveASA/FED
I was asked this question last night and wanted to make sure I was right. Is any organization disallowing painted helmets? I have heard several discussions about this, the paint may weaken the helmet etc. I know that they should not paint over the warning label and that they need to ensure they don't sand or paint so thick that they make the NOCSAE symbol unclear. But do any of you know of any league that has actually "banned" or discussed banning painted helmets??

Dave,

With all due respect, I believe this to be a parent/coach subject. This discussion is perpetuated throughout the year, IMO, by people looking for a complaint.

The umpire's job is to enforce the rules for the organization for which they are umpiring at that moment. Obviously, it has no affect in the games you work or you would not have asked the question because you would have checked the book(s) first.

If an organization does have a problem with painted helmets, that's just what it is, their problem and the umpires working their games will know about it.

As far as certification is concerned, unless a company is willing to incur the expense of serializing each helmet and providing a picture of the helmet as it comes off the line, it is useless. Also, no amount of certification absolves ANYONE from the long arms of the legal system in this country.

JMHO,


[Edited by IRISHMAFIA on Apr 27th, 2004 at 12:37 PM]

[Big_Foot]

LL does not allow painted helments, however, we are finding that some local areas are ignoreing that rule and letting it happen anyway. I always advise my customers to check with the fiels, schools, leauges, etc that they play at.BTW water base and oil base enamel paint does not hurt the helmet. Call a legit compay like Schutt who sells girls softball and ask them about these types of paints. Talk to someone who is a expert on this there. Also I will tell you that when you use a automotive clearcoat on these helments it just makes them harder. I hope this helps.

[EugeneCoug]

Thanks for the responses to my earlier post. I don't know this, but I would speculate that LL prohibits paint on helmets as much to encourage uniformity as to ensure safety. Let's face it: LL, not unlike the NFL, would like to make sure the players adhere to some standards. It is not so much that LL wants to stamp out creativity, but instead LL wants to adopt rules that discourage rattiness or nonmatching uniforms/helmets. I could be wrong on this, of course.

Speaking ASA, however, there simply is no rule that outright prohibits painting. Unfortunately, some umpires believe the myth that there is such a rule. Most don't, a few do.

What I have seen quite often are ASA teams with helmets that don't match and don't even come close. Different colors or funky designs, paint, stickers, etc. that are unique to each player. My recollection is that ASA rules DO prohibit that, but there is little, if any enforcement of any such uniformity requirement. I'm not advocating there should be enforcement, but I've just never seen it. Just like I've never seen a team told they must wear matching sleeves, sliders and visors. Maybe it happens routinely, but the teams we've faced for the last five years must have gotten lucky, because they rarely are in compliance.

It would be ironic if teams with matching painted helmets (with all warning labels and visible NOCSAE logos) would be prohibited from using them due to a no-paint myth, while uniformity requirements are ignored. The comeback to that, I guess, would be that the uniformity requirement isn't a safety issue while the paint is. Every football team in America should stop painting their helmets, I guess.

[Del-Blue]

What everyone needs to understand is that the rules are for championship play. Many leagues allow variations to the rules guring the season. I for one would not prohibit a player guring the regular season from playing if they didn't have matching sliders.I would mention it to the coach that if they move on to championship play, they must match.

Now back to the helments. The only organization where the helments must match in color is NCAA.

[Dakota]

Originally posted by EugeneCoug
The comeback to that, I guess, would be that the uniformity requirement isn't a safety issue while the paint is. Every football team in America should stop painting their helmets, I guess.

The safety issue is overblown, but it is real.

Paint involves chemicals, and there are many different kinds of paints, some of which have chemicals in them that react with plastic and can weaken it. It is a possibility that LL bans painting helmets since it is simpler than trying to police "proper" painting.

Personally, I think this should be left between the consumer and the manufacturer, and leave the game officials out of it.

Hockey seemes to have survived just fine with individualism being expressed on goalie helmets.

[Big_Foot]

Goldie helmets are made from diffrent materials and can be painted just like a car.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by EugeneCoug
Thanks for the responses to my earlier post. I don't know this, but I would speculate that LL prohibits paint on helmets as much to encourage uniformity as to ensure safety. Let's face it: LL, not unlike the NFL, would like to make sure the players adhere to some standards. It is not so much that LL wants to stamp out creativity, but instead LL wants to adopt rules that discourage rattiness or nonmatching uniforms/helmets. I could be wrong on this, of course.

Speaking ASA, however, there simply is no rule that outright prohibits painting. Unfortunately, some umpires believe the myth that there is such a rule. Most don't, a few do.

What I have seen quite often are ASA teams with helmets that don't match and don't even come close. Different colors or funky designs, paint, stickers, etc. that are unique to each player. My recollection is that ASA rules DO prohibit that, but there is little, if any enforcement of any such uniformity requirement. I'm not advocating there should be enforcement, but I've just never seen it. Just like I've never seen a team told they must wear matching sleeves, sliders and visors. Maybe it happens routinely, but the teams we've faced for the last five years must have gotten lucky, because they rarely are in compliance.

It would be ironic if teams with matching painted helmets (with all warning labels and visible NOCSAE logos) would be prohibited from using them due to a no-paint myth, while uniformity requirements are ignored. The comeback to that, I guess, would be that the uniformity requirement isn't a safety issue while the paint is. Every football team in America should stop painting their helmets, I guess.

ASA Rules -
No where in Rule 2 Sec. 5 E. Helmets, does it mention that all
helmets match.

[Big Kahuna]

We had an umpire meeting for Dixie Youth last night, and were told that under no circumstances were we to allow a painted helmet onto the field.

[Skahtboi]

Originally posted by Big Kahuna
We had an umpire meeting for Dixie Youth last night, and were told that under no circumstances were we to allow a painted helmet onto the field.

Did you ask them to support that with a rule from the 2004 Dixie Rule book?