E.T. Colvin

[KBoy]

The problem is that different individuals and different teams have different goals. Most of the ASA tournaments are supposed to be set up for the local league teams to compete against other league teams from across the country; The competition has changed the focus to getting the best team together to play tournaments. ASA has made some attempt to keep the league team concept together.

Obviously you can't please all of the people all of the time, so those people that have different views, whether it be about winning, playing for a "geographic" national championship or whatever, will form their own groups to satisfy their own needs.

While not perfect, I think ASA still does a good job at keeping the closest thing resembling a true national championship at all levels of play? I do not necessarily agree with everyone in ASA all the time, but I do believe they are trying to change with the times without abandoning the tried and true loyal members.

[whiskers_ump]

Originally posted by Dakota

I care about JO FP because my daughter plays. I call JO FP to help the local program and because I enjoy the game. Maybe someday I'll "branch out" as you say, but for now, my interest is JO FP.

My concern is not running out of games to call. After all, if the local FP teams go with AFA or whatever, I'll call AFA games.

My concern is for the future of ASA JO FP.

W e l c o m e aboard Tom....We would love to have your
expertise of the fastpitch game on our side....

glen
AFA-ASA-NSA-NFHS-USSSA-PONY-LL(even the dreaded USFA) Umpire

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by KBoy
The problem is that different individuals and different teams have different goals. Most of the ASA tournaments are supposed to be set up for the local league teams to compete against other league teams from across the country; The competition has changed the focus to getting the best team together to play tournaments. ASA has made some attempt to keep the league team concept together.

Obviously you can't please all of the people all of the time, so those people that have different views, whether it be about winning, playing for a "geographic" national championship or whatever, will form their own groups to satisfy their own needs.

While not perfect, I think ASA still does a good job at keeping the closest thing resembling a true national championship at all levels of play? I do not necessarily agree with everyone in ASA all the time, but I do believe they are trying to change with the times without abandoning the tried and true loyal members.

What you are referring to is handled by ASA and known as "B" ball as opposed to JO Gold or A ball which is probably a majority of "travel ball" teams.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Dakota

The issue is a lot more complicated than that. It involves qualificating for ASA nationals (the regional NQ's not being "regional"), the timing of knowing IF you qualify (a mere week or 2 before nationals), the expense of ASA nationals given the distance and the last minute travel costs, and finally, after all that, not really having a shot at a top 20 finish.

"qualificating"? Man, that just sounds dirty. I don't know what is held in your area, but a team can qualify for a NT/NC by winning the previous year, being a host team, winning a Regional, winning a closed NQ (only teams from within the region), winning the HOF tournament, winning an open NQ (open to any team), etc. Some tournaments have more than one berth to offer.

Many teams PLAN and budget based on attending Nationals even before qualifying. If you want to complain about the time period, blame HS ball. It is different in every state. Some states play until Memorial Day and other states start school after the first weekend in August. While some teams are from areas where a player can participate in both simultaneously, some state NFHS bodies forbid it. That leaves every ASA association in the country less than 2 months to hold states, regionals, CNQs and ANQs. And remember, at this point of the year, JO isn't the only game in town, so resources (fields, umpires, etc.) may cause even more limitations than just the calendar.

It's tough no matter what organization you're talking about.

Maybe so, but ASA needs to recognize reality. The ground has shifted underneath girls sports. Who cares if the Orange County Squeezers win the National Championship? Their parents, that's who. Travel teams are not community teams; they have no connection to anyone except their own organization. What do these parents care about (esp at 16U and up, but disturbingly, 14U and below also)?... exposure and a full ride Title IX.

ASA needs to recognize the needs and requirements of their customers. If exposure tournaments are more important than national championships, then provide them, ASA. What's the problem?

Many of the major exposure tournaments are ASA sanctioned. However, ASA is the national governing body which means their job is to provide a national championship. Their mission is not to aid NFCA members in recruiting. ASA NC host staffs (especially 18U & 18U Gold) go to extreme pains and expense to try to accommodate college coaches, but unless you are involved as someone working the tournament, you do not realize that this effort often drains the volunteer and umpire staff to the point it can affect the tournament.

Unfortunately, this has become expected and as the demands (yes, demands) rise from the visiting coaches, it can deter a city from bidding to host such a tournament as it really eats into their profit margin.

[Skahtboi]

Originally posted by IRISHMAFIA
If you want to complain about the time period, blame HS ball. It is different in every state. Some states play until Memorial Day and other states start school after the first weekend in August. While some teams are from areas where a player can participate in both simultaneously, some state NFHS bodies forbid it. That leaves every ASA association in the country less than 2 months to hold states, regionals, CNQs and ANQs.

To lend some creedence to Tom's original post, this is exactly why USSSA has both Spring and Fall State Qualifiers, so that every team wishing to try to win a berth to a State Tourney has ample opportunity. They have also introduced their point system as another road to State and National Tournaments.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by Skahtboi

To lend some creedence to Tom's original post, this is exactly why USSSA has both Spring and Fall State Qualifiers, so that every team wishing to try to win a berth to a State Tourney has ample opportunity. They have also introduced their point system as another road to State and National Tournaments.

Which sort of creates a slanted field as not all areas play fall softball either due to weather or other social priorities. Nor do all teams have time to recruit, practice and bring a newly rostered team in time to the level of qualifying for a National. This would need to happen as half of the previous year's team members would possibly change on January 1 of the following year. Does U-trip do anything to allow for the age change?

And then you have those states which play fall softball and do not allow their players to participate in other programs. I don't agree with this, but it's out there and would just be one more thing someone would complain about.

But then again, nothing new here and not everyone is going to be happy all the time. It's called life and people just need to learn to live with it.



[Edited by IRISHMAFIA on Nov 20th, 2003 at 09:59 PM]

[greymule]

There were proposals to requires all players to require their PSAT/SAT scores or the team could not participate. So, personal choice and failure to provide such scores by any one player would ban participation by an entire team.

I don't pay attention to FP outside New Jersey, so I don't know what's behind these proposals. What does playing softball have to do with taking math and English aptitude tests?

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally posted by greymule
There were proposals to requires all players to require their PSAT/SAT scores or the team could not participate. So, personal choice and failure to provide such scores by any one player would ban participation by an entire team.

I don't pay attention to FP outside New Jersey, so I don't know what's behind these proposals. What does playing softball have to do with taking math and English aptitude tests?

It is kowtowing to the college coaches. This is part of the problem holding some tournaments is problematic. At the 18U & 18U Gold, there is so many resources spent on statistics, it draws from other aspects of the tournament. This was an effort to demand that much more information and comes from a sect that believes the sole purpose of softball is to attain a scholarship.

So, these folks were willing to DQ a team if a player chooses not to provide this information or if, and it does happen, a player doesn't take an SAT. To me, that is not the purpose of the game. And can you imagine the lawsuits when kids are denied the right to play because THEY are there for the game and not the scholarship?

[greymule]

So the college scout, not wanting to waste time considering players who won't get past the admissions office, wants to see the test scores along with the talent.

You're right, though. Some kids—even some very smart ones—don't take the tests. And many high schools, desirous of showing high average test scores to the community, discourage their weaker students from taking them.

Thirty years ago, I tried to scout baseball players for my college, but virtually every prospect was disqualified by his test scores (as in NO chance). I always thought this strange, as they seemed like reasonably bright people.

[TexBlue]

I went back and tracked the thread down. It was DutchUmp#66 from Holland. Since Mike says nothing in Belgium, maybe you can start something up over there???