NFHS Rule Change - Bats

[CecilOne]

A damaged bat will now be defined as a bat that was once legal, but is broken, cracked, dented, rattles or has sharp edges that might deface the ball (Rules 1-5-1, 7-4-2, 2-4-3).

Previously, a damaged bat was considered an illegal bat, with the penalty being an out when the batter entered the batter’s box. Now, damaged bats are simply removed from the game without penalty.

“This rule defines damaged bats and distinguishes them from non-approved and altered bats,” said Sandy Searcy, NFHS director of sports and liaison to the NFHS Softball Rules Committee. “The committee clarified the course of action that should be taken when a damaged bat is discovered in the game.”

Additionally, in Rule 1-5-1, the USA Softball All Games certification mark is now acceptable on bats. The new mark is in addition to the current ASA 2000 and ASA 2004 certification marks. Bats must bear one of these three marks and must not be listed on USA Softball’s Non-Approved Bats With Certification Marks, a list that is available on www.usasoftball.com.

“Bats bearing the 2000 and 2004 certification marks are still permissible, provided they meet specifications in Rule 1-5-1 and do not appear on USA Softball’s Non-Approved Bats with Certification Marks list,” Searcy said.

[teebob21]

Logic when making high school rules? I don't believe it.

Since we don't check bats any more, it's going to have to be pretty damn damaged for me to catch this on the field.

[Stat-Man]

Full article from the NFHS Web Site: (Link) (Archive)

[Andy]

This rule would have come in handy for me recently....

HS Playoff game, I'm PU.

Batter hits a ground ball to F6, fields and throws to first for the out. When the batter dropped the bat after the hit, I thought I heard something when it hit the ground. After the play, I picked up the bat, shook it and heard all kinds of rattling. I called the coach over, showed him the bat, shook it and asked him to put it away and not use it any longer.

Had this rule been in place, no issues. Since I didn't hear any rattling while the player was at bat, I didn't feel justified in applying the illegal bat penalty.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Andy

Since I didn't hear any rattling while the player was at bat, I didn't feel justified in applying the illegal bat penalty.

Agree.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Andy

This rule would have come in handy for me recently....

HS Playoff game, I'm PU.

Batter hits a ground ball to F6, fields and throws to first for the out. When the batter dropped the bat after the hit, I thought I heard something when it hit the ground. After the play, I picked up the bat, shook it and heard all kinds of rattling. I called the coach over, showed him the bat, shook it and asked him to put it away and not use it any longer.

Had this rule been in place, no issues. Since I didn't hear any rattling while the player was at bat, I didn't feel justified in applying the illegal bat penalty.

If I read correctly. you did exactly what the rule says, without needing it.
Although, the rule says " when the batter entered the batter’s box." in the comment, not in the rule itself. Hopefully the published rule book will not be ambiguous.

[IRISHMAFIA]

Originally Posted by Andy

This rule would have come in handy for me recently....

HS Playoff game, I'm PU.

Batter hits a ground ball to F6, fields and throws to first for the out. When the batter dropped the bat after the hit, I thought I heard something when it hit the ground. After the play, I picked up the bat, shook it and heard all kinds of rattling. I called the coach over, showed him the bat, shook it and asked him to put it away and not use it any longer.

Had this rule been in place, no issues. Since I didn't hear any rattling while the player was at bat, I didn't feel justified in applying the illegal bat penalty.

Actually, it is what you should have already been doing in the situation you offered since it wasn't discovered until the bat hit the ground since the argument could be made that is when the damaged occurred.

[chapmaja]

Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA

Actually, it is what you should have already been doing in the situation you offered since it wasn't discovered until the bat hit the ground since the argument could be made that is when the damaged occurred.

I agree. What I have always been told (both at the HS and USA level) is that if you find a bat is dented, cracked or otherwise damaged and it has been used by the batter to contact the ball during the at-bat, you assume the damage occurred during the AB. This simply saved a lot of problems for the umpire and eliminated the argument it became damaged during the AB.

The problem comes in if it is noticed during an AB and the bat never contacted anything during the AB.

An example of this happened at a HS game a friend was working. Batter enters the box and takes her position. First pitch is not swung at as it is way outside. The batter steps back and takes a couple practice swings. The catcher hears something rattling during the swing, as does the PU. The PU calls time as the catcher is questioning the bat. The umpire asks to see the bat and when he gets it he can immediately tell it is rattling significantly.

What does the umpire do in this situation. There was no trauma to the bat during that batters at-bat.

He made her put it away and get another bat, which created a big argument from both coaches.

[CecilOne]

While we are at this, a slight tangent; USA and NFHS rules.

Altered - changed from how it was manufactured
Approved - on the USA list
Non-approved - not on the approved list, currently on the "banned" list

Illegal - was approved, not on banned list; now not "within specs"; including damaged but not altered.

1) Is there another possibility or are all "illegal" bats, in the sense of just an out, as defined as Illegal above?

2) How does a bat go from approved to illegal other than damage?

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

While we are at this, a slight tangent; USA and NFHS rules.

Altered - changed from how it was manufactured
Approved - on the USA list
Non-approved - not on the approved list, currently on the "banned" list

Illegal - was approved, not on banned list; now not "within specs"; including damaged but not altered.

1) Is there another possibility or are all "illegal" bats, in the sense of just an out, as defined as Illegal above?

2) How does a bat go from approved to illegal other than damage?

Does no responses mean there is no answer?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

1) Is there another possibility or are all "illegal" bats, in the sense of just an out, as defined as Illegal above?

2) How does a bat go from approved to illegal other than damage?

Does no responses mean there is no answer?

If memory serves (don't have a rule book handy), an illegal bat is one of three categories: damaged, altered, or non-approved. So a bat going from "approved" to "illegal" can do so under any of the three categories.

1. If an approved bat is altered, it becomes illegal.

2. If an approved bat suddenly becomes non-approved by USA Softball (that hasn't been done in a while), it, too, becomes illegal.

3. If an approved bat becomes damaged, it is now illegal.

Not sure if this answers your questions.

[CecilOne]

Originally Posted by Manny A

If memory serves (don't have a rule book handy), an illegal bat is one of three categories: damaged, altered, or non-approved. So a bat going from "approved" to "illegal" can do so under any of the three categories.

1. If an approved bat is altered, it becomes illegal.

2. If an approved bat suddenly becomes non-approved by USA Softball (that hasn't been done in a while), it, too, becomes illegal.

3. If an approved bat becomes damaged, it is now illegal.

Not sure if this answers your questions.

All of these cover not allowed in different ways. I was addressing the technical use of "illegal"; as in the batter is out, but not ejected/disqualified.

#1 is altered not "illegal".
#2 is non-approved, not "illegal"

#3 is then "illegal"; but my question was whether a bat can be "illegal" any other way. In this question, "damaged" includes defaced, painted, etc.; any non-legal change that is not "altered'.

Again, is there such a thing as illegal beyond that or do we actually have only these 3:
1 Non-approved
2 Altered
3 Damaged
?

[Manny A]

Originally Posted by CecilOne

All of these cover not allowed in different ways. I was addressing the technical use of "illegal"; as in the batter is out, but not ejected/disqualified.

#1 is altered not "illegal".
#2 is non-approved, not "illegal"

#3 is then "illegal"; but my question was whether a bat can be "illegal" any other way. In this question, "damaged" includes defaced, painted, etc.; any non-legal change that is not "altered'.

Again, is there such a thing as illegal beyond that or do we actually have only these 3:
1 Non-approved
2 Altered
3 Damaged
?

Ahh, I understand, I think. You want to treat "illegal" as its own singular category that doesn't include altered or non-approved. I look at it the other way, where all three categories--damaged, altered and non-approved--fall under the umbrella of "illegal", with separate penalties for each.

I suppose a fourth category of "illegal" would be a bat that simply doesn't meet the rules requirements of an official bat. For example, in NFHS play, an illegal bat would include:
- a bat with plastic tape on the handle
- a bat with a grip that extends more than 15 inches from the knob
- a bat with rosin beyond the grip
- a bat with a choke-up device
- a bat with one of those electronic bat-speed sensors that I think NFHS still treats as illegal since it is not permanently fastened

So any bat that has been modified (but not altered to improve its ability through structural change) so that it is no longer in compliance with NFHS 1-5-1 or 1-5-2 is one that goes from "approved" to "illegal".

Now that I think about it, the new NFHS rule for next year treats damaged bats separate from any other illegal bat that isn't altered or non-approved. So now when a batter uses a bat that's illegal because it has slippery tape, a choke-up device, an electronic sensor, etc., it's still an out on the batter but not an ejection. But for a damaged bat, there is no out; we just remove that bat from the game with no penalty.