The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Softball

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Thu Feb 08, 2018, 05:52pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 589
NHFS - Lineup card must list all players on a team's roster. True or false?

Looking for opinions. I disagree with the Fed test writers, but I'd like to hear what the board says.
__________________
Powder blue since 1998. Longtime forum lurker.
Umpiring Goals: Call the knee strike accurately (getting the low pitch since 2017)/NCAA D1 postseason/ISF-WBSC Certification/Nat'l Indicator Fraternity(completed)
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Thu Feb 08, 2018, 06:10pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Derry, NH
Posts: 940
At the risk of incurring a warning, the coach might not include every eligible substitute.

If a player wasn't scheduled to be at the game showed up mid-game, the coach could add her name to the lineup card. And that would result in a warning. If another player showed up or there was some other lineup card violation, the coach would be restricted to the dugout for the remainder of the game.

So just reading Article 3 as is, I'd say the answer would be yes to including everyone. But I'll second your concept that sometimes we can argue for different answers.

The penalty is rather mild, considering that NFHS stresses safety and participation for the sport.

We had a question regarding a suspended game from early in the season that was continued late in the season. We were told not to penalize for additions to the lineup cards when the game resumed. Players might not be available anymore due to various reasons, and new players may have been added. E.G. some players brought up from JV to Varsity.
__________________
Ted
USA & NFHS Softball
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Thu Feb 08, 2018, 07:51pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,217
Rule 3 article 3 answers your question. The lineup card shall include each starting player and each eligible substitute.

As stated above, the coach can choose to not list all the players but if he tries to add them.later there are penalties associated with it.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Thu Feb 08, 2018, 08:27pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 589
Quote:
Originally Posted by RKBUmp View Post
Rule 3 article 3 answers your question. The lineup card shall include each starting player and each eligible substitute.

As stated above, the coach can choose to not list all the players but if he tries to add them.later there are penalties associated with it.
Player Suzy Q is out sick. She is on my team's roster. As a coach, I do not put her on the lineup card. She does not play. Is this legal?

If so, it would seem that the statement "all players on the roster must be on the lineup card" is false. Even if I choose to add her later, all I earn is a team warning. If I'm overthinking this, just tell me.
__________________
Powder blue since 1998. Longtime forum lurker.
Umpiring Goals: Call the knee strike accurately (getting the low pitch since 2017)/NCAA D1 postseason/ISF-WBSC Certification/Nat'l Indicator Fraternity(completed)
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Thu Feb 08, 2018, 08:53pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,217
You are over thinking it, the answer is true.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Thu Feb 08, 2018, 09:36pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Twin Cities MN
Posts: 8,147
NFHS tests are notorious for "almost true" or "it depends" questions (which, by logic, means false) where the "correct" answer is "true".

If you can find a sentence in the NFHS rule book that is nearly word for word with the question, the answer is "true" regardless of exceptions or logic.
__________________
Tom
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Fri Feb 09, 2018, 10:16am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 14,289
If a coach handed you a line-up card with 13 names on it and there were only 9 players present, are you accepting it?
__________________
The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball.
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Fri Feb 09, 2018, 12:31pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Maine
Posts: 148
Yes I accept it.
__________________
Ken
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Fri Feb 09, 2018, 01:00pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: The Land Of The Free and The Home Of The Brave (MD/DE)
Posts: 6,002
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
If a coach handed you a line-up card with 13 names on it and there were only 9 players present, are you accepting it?
There are a lot of those, especially with coaches who use preprinted lineup forms and fill in that day's players.
__________________
Officiating takes more than OJT.
It's not our jobs to invent rulings to fit our personal idea of what should and should not be.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Fri Feb 09, 2018, 02:04pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 518
don't think I've ever counted the number of players in the dugout....
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Fri Feb 09, 2018, 09:28pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 14,289
Quote:
Originally Posted by jmkupka View Post
don't think I've ever counted the number of players in the dugout....
Then how do you know they have enough to start?
__________________
The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 09:50am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Twin Cities MN
Posts: 8,147
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
If a coach handed you a line-up card with 13 names on it and there were only 9 players present, are you accepting it?
Absolutely. It is usual that the JV team is playing on another near-by field and the coach will give some of the JV players varsity playing time if conditions allow or require. So, it is usual that some of the listed subs are on the JV team.

Now, admittedly, having ALL of the subs on the JV team would not be expected, but I'd allow it.
__________________
Tom
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 08:27pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: SE Ohio
Posts: 918
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
If a coach handed you a line-up card with 13 names on it and there were only 9 players present, are you accepting it?
I've always told coaches that unless you have a participation rule from the league or school, list your entire school roster if you have to as you never get penalized by having too many players listed. Especially if you have to suspend a game to be resumed as you cannot change the lineup(may vary state to state here).
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Mon Feb 12, 2018, 11:43pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 14,289
Not a fan. Ever have a coach try to sub someone who was not there?

IMO, it just isn't necessary to have an entire roster listed on a line-up card. Also, I believe it is ludicrous to penalize a team in any manner for adding a roster player to the line-up card.
__________________
The bat issue in softball is as much about liability, insurance and litigation as it is about competition, inflated egos and softball.
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Tue Feb 13, 2018, 12:18am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 589
Quote:
Originally Posted by IRISHMAFIA View Post
Not a fan. Ever have a coach try to sub someone who was not there?

IMO, it just isn't necessary to have an entire roster listed on a line-up card. Also, I believe it is ludicrous to penalize a team in any manner for adding a roster player to the line-up card.
And NOW we get back to my original thought...it's not necessary, except for the fact that NFHS rules require it. I missed this test question. I answered False.
__________________
Powder blue since 1998. Longtime forum lurker.
Umpiring Goals: Call the knee strike accurately (getting the low pitch since 2017)/NCAA D1 postseason/ISF-WBSC Certification/Nat'l Indicator Fraternity(completed)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
R2 and lineup card jodibuck Volleyball 4 Wed Oct 01, 2014 07:46pm
Not on lineup card !!!! THREE Softball 16 Wed Sep 02, 2009 03:50pm
Lineup Card - Unlisted Players Prince Baseball 1 Sun Jun 26, 2005 05:55pm
umpire's lineup card newkidonthenet Volleyball 10 Sat Oct 23, 2004 09:36am
lineup card question Little Jimmy Softball 7 Sat Oct 18, 2003 01:10pm


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:00pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1