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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 08:05am
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When is a Batter out of the Box?

When a batter is contacted by his/her own batted ball, by most rule sets he/she is out if the ball is in fair territory. But the prevailing interpretation is that he/she is given the benefit of the doubt while still in the batter's box, and the call is a dead ball followed by a foul ball ruling.

So how do we define when the batter is out of the box? Is it just one foot completely on the ground outside the box, similar to the rule on hitting a pitch while out of the box? Or is it both feet?

I had a play this weekend where the right-handed batter bunted the ball just in front of home plate, and as she took off for first base, she made contact with the ball with her front knee. When it happened, it appeared her front foot was on the ground in front of the plate, but most of her body, to include her back foot, was still in the batter's box. Basically, she was more inside the box than out, but her front foot looked to be outside and on the ground.

I've always called it where it's blatantly obvious the batter is well outside the box, but it's that grey area that I'm not too sure about. How is it defined?
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 08:16am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
When a batter is contacted by his/her own batted ball, by most rule sets he/she is out if the ball is in fair territory. But the prevailing interpretation is that he/she is given the benefit of the doubt while still in the batter's box, and the call is a dead ball followed by a foul ball ruling.

So how do we define when the batter is out of the box? Is it just one foot completely on the ground outside the box, similar to the rule on hitting a pitch while out of the box? Or is it both feet?

I had a play this weekend where the right-handed batter bunted the ball just in front of home plate, and as she took off for first base, she made contact with the ball with her front knee. When it happened, it appeared her front foot was on the ground in front of the plate, but most of her body, to include her back foot, was still in the batter's box. Basically, she was more inside the box than out, but her front foot looked to be outside and on the ground.

I've always called it where it's blatantly obvious the batter is well outside the box, but it's that grey area that I'm not too sure about. How is it defined?
Was the BALL in the batter's box when the batter and ball contacted each other?
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 08:29am
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
Was the BALL in the batter's box when the batter and ball contacted each other?
It appeared the ball was in front of home plate. I really couldn't see exactly where it was since the batter screened me as she headed toward first, but I don't believe it was inside the box.
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 09:51am
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Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
It appeared the ball was in front of home plate. I really couldn't see exactly where it was since the batter screened me as she headed toward first, but I don't believe it was inside the box.
My question was an answer to your question ... not a question in and of itself. That question is what you should be asking.
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 12:07pm
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Good question.

If part of a batter's foot is outside a line of the batter's box (when there ARE lines), s/he is considered to be out of the box. If s/he swings and contacts the ball, the batter is out.

Leaving the batter's box seems to have a bit more leeway in regards to the batter contacting the batted ball. If a foot was completely down and outside of the batter's box when contacting the ball, that's an obvious out. But if the foot was still down in the batter's box, or elevated either within or outside the batter's box, I believe that's still legal.

I had a similar call a while back with a right-handed batter bunting. The ball went straight down and hit the plate and popped straight back up. After the bunt, the batter's left foot was completely out of the box and on the ground. Then contact occurred with the ball. Her back foot/leg were still in the batter's box, but I couldn't say if the back foot was off the ground at that point.

I "gave the batter the benefit of the doubt" and called a dead ball, and then foul ball. Offensive coach liked it, defensive coach didn't.
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Last edited by Tru_in_Blu; Tue Mar 14, 2017 at 12:10pm.
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 12:33pm
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The rule only says "making contact with a fair batted ball"; nothing about where the BR is or anything about feet.

As far as I know, we only call it an out if the BR is clearly out of the box (rule/interp. cite anyone?), meaning both feet.
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 12:40pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tru_in_Blu View Post

If part of a batter's foot is outside a line of the batter's box (when there ARE lines), s/he is considered to be out of the box. If s/he swings and contacts the ball, the batter is out.
.
See new topic "out of box bat contact "
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 01:08pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manny A View Post
When a batter is contacted by his/her own batted ball, by most rule sets he/she is out if the ball is in fair territory. But the prevailing interpretation is that he/she is given the benefit of the doubt while still in the batter's box, and the call is a dead ball followed by a foul ball ruling.

So how do we define when the batter is out of the box? Is it just one foot completely on the ground outside the box, similar to the rule on hitting a pitch while out of the box? Or is it both feet?

I had a play this weekend where the right-handed batter bunted the ball just in front of home plate, and as she took off for first base, she made contact with the ball with her front knee. When it happened, it appeared her front foot was on the ground in front of the plate, but most of her body, to include her back foot, was still in the batter's box. Basically, she was more inside the box than out, but her front foot looked to be outside and on the ground.

I've always called it where it's blatantly obvious the batter is well outside the box, but it's that grey area that I'm not too sure about. How is it defined?
For a start, you are either applying the wrong rule or misstating the play you had. There are two distinctly separate rules, one applying when the batted ball contacts a batter that hasn't yet left the batter's box, and a second that applies when a batter-runner contacts a fair batted ball (ANY fair batted ball, INCLUDING when in the batter's box). The judgment is to be similar to "did the ball hit the discarded bat, or did the discarded bat hit the ball".

By your description of the play, the batter-runner is simply out, with no other judgment required, because YOU said "she made contact with the ball". The batter's box has no bearing and does not even apply to this play.

As to your question, the NCAA, at least, makes their ruling clear; the definition of "out" as it applies any/every line and space on the field is one one foot completely "out". See Rule 2.16, and Appendix A. And there is nothing there that appears to conflict with any other rules set; I would apply the same to all other rules sets.
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Last edited by AtlUmpSteve; Tue Mar 14, 2017 at 03:07pm.
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 01:39pm
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Hmmm... Perhaps I've been using the wrong criterion to make the determination if the batter contacts a fair ball. I've always believed that we give the benefit of the doubt to the batter if she contacts the ball while she's still in the box, since it would be very difficult at that point to judge where the ball was in terms of fair or foul territory.

But if we can tell beyond a shadow of a doubt that it was fair when she touched it as she was leaving the box, it doesn't matter where she is in relation to her feet and the box? That's good to know; I've probably given away too many outs in my days!
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 02:38pm
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In USA Softball: RS 7
BATTING OUT OF THE BATTER'S BOX
To call a batter out for batting out of the batter's box, one foot or both feet must be on the ground completely outside the lines of the batter's box when contact is made with the ball. The lines of the batter's box are considered inside the batter's box.

............When there are no batter's box lines, good judgment should be used and the benefit of doubt should go to the batter. If contact is not made with the ball, there is no penalty.

Rule 7, Section 4: A strike on the batter
When any part of the batter’s person or clothing is hit with a batted ball while the batter is in the batter’s box and (FP) has fewer than two strikes.

don't these 2 statements combine to mean that if one foot is on the ground, completely out of the batter's box and not touching the line, the batter is out. If foot is in the air or touching the line or completely inside the lines when the batter and ball meet, the batter is not out.
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Old Tue Mar 14, 2017, 03:44pm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by josephrt1 View Post
In USA Softball: RS 7
BATTING OUT OF THE BATTER'S BOX
To call a batter out for batting out of the batter's box, one foot or both feet must be on the ground completely outside the lines of the batter's box when contact is made with the ball. The lines of the batter's box are considered inside the batter's box.

............When there are no batter's box lines, good judgment should be used and the benefit of doubt should go to the batter. If contact is not made with the ball, there is no penalty.

Rule 7, Section 4: A strike on the batter
When any part of the batter’s person or clothing is hit with a batted ball while the batter is in the batter’s box and (FP) has fewer than two strikes.

don't these 2 statements combine to mean that if one foot is on the ground, completely out of the batter's box and not touching the line, the batter is out. If foot is in the air or touching the line or completely inside the lines when the batter and ball meet, the batter is not out.
See new topic "out of box bat contact "
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