The Official Forum  

Go Back   The Official Forum > Football

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)  
Old Sat Sep 14, 2013, 07:58pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,262
Duplicate Number Question

First, I'm not a football referee so just looking for some information here.

NCAA says "Two players playing the same position may not wear the same number during the game."

In the Cal/OSU game, the Cal QB and the Cal punter both are wearing 16. In the second quarter, the quarterback lines up as the punter in a kicking formation. Is this a violation of the rule? Why or why not?
Reply With Quote
  #2 (permalink)  
Old Sat Sep 14, 2013, 10:46pm
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,463
To make a long story short, it is not illegal to have multiple players with the same number. Actually it would be almost impossible to field some teams if you could not duplicate numbers. So the NCAA allows (as well as High School) duplicate numbers as long as they are not on the field at the same time. So a punter and a quarterback theoretically are not going to be on the field at the same time. So in your example it would not be illegal to do what you witnessed.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)

Last edited by JRutledge; Sat Sep 14, 2013 at 10:56pm.
Reply With Quote
  #3 (permalink)  
Old Sat Sep 14, 2013, 10:47pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,875
It's "the same down", not "the same position". They'd have to be on the field during the same live ball for it to be a violation.
Reply With Quote
  #4 (permalink)  
Old Sat Sep 14, 2013, 11:10pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Goodman View Post
It's "the same down", not "the same position". They'd have to be on the field during the same live ball for it to be a violation.
New NCAA rule this year added so players playing the same position can't wear the same number. So you can't have 2 different QBs wearing #16. The intent of the rule is not to prevent two punters or two guards or two long snappers. I believe the situation in the original post would not be an issue.
Reply With Quote
  #5 (permalink)  
Old Sun Sep 15, 2013, 07:14am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,262
Quote:
Originally Posted by bisonlj View Post
New NCAA rule this year added so players playing the same position can't wear the same number. So you can't have 2 different QBs wearing #16. The intent of the rule is not to prevent two punters or two guards or two long snappers. I believe the situation in the original post would not be an issue.
It is a new rule. However, I would have to think the intention is to specifically prevent having two punters wearing the same number.

It certainly gave Cal an advantage in that game as they were able to sneak their QB into a punting formation and pulled off a first down.
Reply With Quote
  #6 (permalink)  
Old Sun Sep 15, 2013, 08:06am
Chain of Fools
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,648
Apparent loophole in the rule. What you are listed as on a roster has nothing to do where you line up on the field.
Reply With Quote
  #7 (permalink)  
Old Sun Sep 15, 2013, 10:37am
Do not give a damn!!
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: On the border
Posts: 30,463
Quote:
Originally Posted by HLin NC View Post
Apparent loophole in the rule. What you are listed as on a roster has nothing to do where you line up on the field.
If you look just at the rule, there is no explanation how we are to know what position a player is supposed to play. Maybe there is a case play, but I cannot find one. I think the rule had a good intention, but did not think it through as to how this is to be identified. It is not like we have an "Official book" to use as a basis.

Peace
__________________
Let us get into "Good Trouble."
-----------------------------------------------------------
Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010)
Reply With Quote
  #8 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 09:37am
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,262
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRutledge View Post
If you look just at the rule, there is no explanation how we are to know what position a player is supposed to play. Maybe there is a case play, but I cannot find one. I think the rule had a good intention, but did not think it through as to how this is to be identified. It is not like we have an "Official book" to use as a basis.

Peace
That's what I thought: there's no official designation as to what a position is. Makes the rule fairly useless then.
Reply With Quote
  #9 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 10:04am
Chain of Fools
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,648
It is more administrative in nature. Nobody is going to tell a coach you can't shift a LB to FB because some 5th string walk on is already wearing #35.
Reply With Quote
  #10 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 12:00pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
I suspect that a violation of this rule is more likely to be punished after the game, by the NCAA itself - and not by officials on the field. Honestly, if some team had two different punters, or WR's, or guard's etc with the same number, I'm VERY unlikely to catch it.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #11 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 01:26pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 122
I'd likely call this a violation of the rule. I don't have the exact text of the rule right now so I don't know what the enforcement would be.
Reply With Quote
  #12 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 01:31pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by bwburke94 View Post
I'd likely call this a violation of the rule. I don't have the exact text of the rule right now so I don't know what the enforcement would be.
Do you mean you'd call the OP a violation? You shouldn't, it's not.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #13 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 02:00pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
Do you mean you'd call the OP a violation? You shouldn't, it's not.
Did 2 # 16's lineup in the same position (punter). Yes=foul.
Reply With Quote
  #14 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 02:07pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 8,033
Quote:
Originally Posted by parepat View Post
Did 2 # 16's lineup in the same position (punter). Yes=foul.
Again ... where they start on the field, with a few exceptions, does not necessarily define their position... and in this particular case, one is a punter, the other a quarterback. They are not both punters.
__________________
I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'”

West Houston Mike
Reply With Quote
  #15 (permalink)  
Old Mon Sep 16, 2013, 02:38pm
Official Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 508
Quote:
Originally Posted by MD Longhorn View Post
Again ... where they start on the field, with a few exceptions, does not necessarily define their position... and in this particular case, one is a punter, the other a quarterback. They are not both punters.
The rule says "during the game". IMO this is clearly a foul and falls squarely within the letter and intent of the rule. The more fuzzy aspects of it are:
#2 plays split end. The other #2 later comes in and plays the slot. Now what?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Illegal number and penalty question? JRutledge Basketball 15 Wed Feb 27, 2013 05:40pm
Duplicate numbers ?? Remington Basketball 10 Sat Feb 12, 2011 11:53am
Illegal number Question BigGref Football 9 Fri Sep 02, 2005 02:50pm
Duplicate Number bard Basketball 25 Sat Dec 07, 2002 09:32am
Duplicate numbers Hawks Coach Basketball 11 Fri Jan 05, 2001 09:46am


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:36pm.



Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.3.0 RC1