NFHS Football Rules Changes

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

My eyes are good -- I can pick up a bad block at the 25-30 from a long distance away. I have *no chance* to pick up that block, however, if I'm the L and the kick threatens my sideline behind me. None.

I'd rather have 7 officials, but we're not getting any more anytime soon.

I do not agree with that necessarily as it is based on what you are focused on and what you have experience doing. I am just saying that the GL is one of the easiest things to cover on a kick off and you do not need 3 guys to do it. You are always going to have holes no matter what we do with 5 officials, but the GL is usually based solely on the ability of the kicker and not many HS teams have a kicker that can even threaten the GL in the first place. I would rather put more officials further up the field. Seven officials would be much better of course, but until that happens putting the majority of the 5 man crew at a place where little takes place is not IMO helpful to total coverage. If they did change it, we would deal with it, but I do not think it is the best way to cover these plays, especially with many players withing the first 20 yards from the kick off line.

Peace

[bisonlj]

We implemented Matt's suggestion this year and started the U and H on the 10 with the R on the goal line. The U and H aren't helping as much with goal line for touchbacks but does need to be in position to rule on balls that threaten the pylon. If you start on the 20 or 30 you will have a hard time getting that angle. The pylon wasn't threatened often but it was enough that we appreciated being where we were.

The better reason for starting there was the ability to keep everything in front of you and not having the kick pass by your face. If we had teams that always kicked short or pooch kicked it to the 30-40 we had no problems covering that.

In our last playoff game I had a kicker sail one that flew about 10 yards OVER the top of the pylon. I reacted late so I wasn't standing at the pylon when it went over but I was close enough I felt comfortable ruling touchback. We started the rest of the game on the pylon. Most of the kicks threatened the goal line (over 100 points scored so there were a lot of kicks) and a couple threatened the pylon. We also had some pooch kicks that we were able to cover with no issues.

I personally think it would be better to have the H and L deep since they are more accustomed to ruling on things like progress. If they want 3 with the kick lines then I think the R and whoever else is deep should both start on the plyons. They can move up if the kicks are consistently short.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I do not agree with that necessarily as it is based on what you are focused on and what you have experience doing. I am just saying that the GL is one of the easiest things to cover on a kick off and you do not need 3 guys to do it. You are always going to have holes no matter what we do with 5 officials, but the GL is usually based solely on the ability of the kicker and not many HS teams have a kicker that can even threaten the GL in the first place. I would rather put more officials further up the field. Seven officials would be much better of course, but until that happens putting the majority of the 5 man crew at a place where little takes place is not IMO helpful to total coverage. If they did change it, we would deal with it, but I do not think it is the best way to cover these plays, especially with many players withing the first 20 yards from the kick off line.

Peace

The majority of the illegal blocks I see on kickoffs are on the first threat to the returner -- not up the field further. Most of those illegal blocks are inside the 20, in my experience, unless a kick is broken through the first line of defense.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

The majority of the illegal blocks I see on kickoffs are on the first threat to the returner -- not up the field further. Most of those illegal blocks are inside the 20, in my experience, unless a kick is broken through the first line of defense.

But what kind of illegal are they? When you have team K running full speed past a set of blockers close to their own restraining line, the incentive to reach outside and grab someone otherwise whooshing by must be great. Those players on team R are often among the slowest on the roster, and it's hard for them to get their bodies in the path of the coverage.

[bcl1127]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

But what kind of illegal are they? When you have team K running full speed past a set of blockers close to their own restraining line, the incentive to reach outside and grab someone otherwise whooshing by must be great. Those players on team R are often among the slowest on the roster, and it's hard for them to get their bodies in the path of the coverage.

BIB is very very common.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by bcl1127

BIB is very very common.

But we're looking at what RichMSN picks up most often. How do we know that he's not seeing most BiB, and missing the holds in the situation described above?

[CT1]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

But what kind of illegal are they?

Mostly either BiB or BBW.

Those players on team R are often among the slowest on the roster, and it's hard for them to get their bodies in the path of the coverage.

I wonder how much high-level football you really see. R's players (at least around here) are usually among the best athletes on the team. Holding by R before the runback starts is very rare.

[bcl1127]

Originally Posted by CT1

I wonder how much high-level football you really see. R's players (at least around here) are usually among the best athletes on the team. Holding by R before the runback starts is very rare.

Agreed here...I was thinking the same thing when I read the OP

[Rich]

Originally Posted by CT1

Mostly either BiB or BBW.


I wonder how much high-level football you really see. R's players (at least around here) are usually among the best athletes on the team. Holding by R before the runback starts is very rare.

Holding is common close to the LOS on punts, typically by R players slowing up gunners. Just doesn't happen on kickoffs, IME.

Most illegal activity on kickoffs, in my experience, are close to the point of attack - either IBB or IBBW. I'd say that with the current mechanics system I personally flag at least half of those fouls. Clearly, if there's a long return, that foul can be downfield, however many of these fouls happen right around the time R catches the ball.

My point is that I think the the AZ mechanic puts the officials where I think they can see the most without sacrificing sideline / pylon coverage.

[Robert Goodman]

Originally Posted by CT1

I wonder how much high-level football you really see. R's players (at least around here) are usually among the best athletes on the team.

I meant the ones lined up close to the neutral zone.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I meant the ones lined up close to the neutral zone.

And those are the ones I would be most concerned about. Yes contact might take place after the return, but I have yet to see an official if positioned properly that cannot tell if the ball was across the GL. Unlike college the ball is dead when it crosses the GL. To rule on that is an easy call to make. The players in that first wave often do other things that need attention that is why I would not like that change at all from having been in both positions on the field. If they changed, oh well. I am sure my crew would discuss the coverage and what is more important to observe. We did that already and covered the game just fine.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

And those are the ones I would be most concerned about. Yes contact might take place after the return, but I have yet to see an official if positioned properly that cannot tell if the ball was across the GL. Unlike college the ball is dead when it crosses the GL. To rule on that is an easy call to make. The players in that first wave often do other things that need attention that is why I would not like that change at all from having been in both positions on the field. If they changed, oh well. I am sure my crew would discuss the coverage and what is more important to observe. We did that already and covered the game just fine.

Peace

Except I don't really care about the coverage on the GL -- it's the fact that an L or U *must* turn his head if the ball threatens the sideline behind him or the pylon that bothers me -- it essentially takes an official completely out of the play and takes him away from watching players even near to him.

[CT1]

Originally Posted by Robert Goodman

I meant the ones lined up close to the neutral zone.

I can't think of the last time I enforced a holding call against an R player near the NZ on a kickoff return. It just doesn't happen around here. The fouls we typically see on KOs happen just before or just after the return man receives the ball.