Irate Coach - First time flagging a coach

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by PocketSidewalk

I recently worked a middle school game at the HL position.

I did not need to read anymore. Of course you did.

Peace

[JugglingReferee]

As soon as this coach is yelling AT you in the way that you describe, and just 2 feet from you out onto the field, flag him, and get away from him. Let him sink himself if he wants to shower early.

The only thing I can suggest is that the learning point here is to recognize abhorrent behaviour and not to get worked up over it. Just flag it and move on.

As for issuing a sideline warning, I wouldn't have - i would have stayed with the USC. (But then again, since I work up here in Canada, our philosophies are likely different. It begins with coaches not being permitting on the field at all for any reason other than an injury.)

[InsideTheStripe]

Your WH did everyone a disservice. If a coach on the hashes screaming in your face isn't unsportsmanlike conduct, I don't know what is. In this situation, I'd have walked off the 15 and dumped the coach in a NY minute.

[HLin NC]

One of my WH's tells us in pre-game- "you have a gun, use it". That is not a sideline warning, particularly at the MS level.

After you sort out the spot and the penalty enforcement, "Would you still like your time-out, coach?"

[mbyron]

Any one of these is sufficient for a USC flag:
1. the coach chasing you in to the hash
2. the coach screaming in your face
3. the coach repeating himself over and over, which shows you up

You had all 3, which borders on flagrant.

The WH has no business sticking his nose in this, as it is your call. Once you throw that flag, it needs to be enforced, or you lose any remaining credibility. If he wants to mentor you about the advisability of that flag, he can do that after the game.

[PocketSidewalk]

Originally Posted by mbyron

The WH has no business sticking his nose in this, as it is your call. Once you throw that flag, it needs to be enforced, or you lose any remaining credibility. If he wants to mentor you about the advisability of that flag, he can do that after the game.

My intention in starting this thread wasn't to criticize my WH or even to ask if what he did was right or wrong. That being said, I did feel like I lost some credibility when the penalty was changed to just a warning. It really just added more uncertainty to an already tense and stressful situation.

I really like this official, and I enjoy working on the crew when he's the WH. This particular incident hasn't changed my feelings one way or another. It's hard to say why he did what he did; I'm sure he had his reasons, right or wrong.

Ultimately I've tried to avoid too much speculation into his motives because I don't want to create any ill will in my own mind that could possibly hurt our professional relationship.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'd like to give this official the benefit of the doubt, at least this once.

[BuckeyeRef]

Originally Posted by PocketSidewalk

My intention in starting this thread wasn't to criticize my WH or even to ask if what he did was right or wrong. That being said, I did feel like I lost some credibility when the penalty was changed to just a warning. It really just added more uncertainty to an already tense and stressful situation.

I really like this official, and I enjoy working on the crew when he's the WH. This particular incident hasn't changed my feelings one way or another. It's hard to say why he did what he did; I'm sure he had his reasons, right or wrong.

Ultimately I've tried to avoid too much speculation into his motives because I don't want to create any ill will in my own mind that could possibly hurt our professional relationship.

I guess what I'm saying is that I'd like to give this official the benefit of the doubt, at least this once.

I think the other thing you should change was in your original post you told the WH he could wave off the flag if he thought it was the right thing to do and you left the call up to the WH. If you throw the flag, it's your call. Make the call and stick with it. Don't force the WH to make a decision when he was not the official who was being yelled at.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

I did not need to read anymore. Of course you did.

Peace

What does THAT mean? BTW, I did the exact same thing last Tuesday. I had a blast and so did the kids.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

What does THAT mean? BTW, I did the exact same thing last Tuesday. I had a blast and so did the kids.

Middle school and JH coaches are often over the top and out of control. Of course he had to throw a flag for a situation. It does not matter how well the crew did or what was said, the outcome is not surprising to me.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by JRutledge

Middle school and JH coaches are often over the top and out of control. Of course he had to throw a flag for a situation. It does not matter how well the crew did or what was said, the outcome is not surprising to me.

Peace

I choose to work youth games only where the coaches are in control. Makes my life easier. About 10 years ago I worked a youth Saturday and the coaches acted like this, so I started throwing flags. The president of the league called me and told me that the coaches didn't want me back -- I told him that it was OK, I wouldn't come back even if they did UNLESS the program was willing to clamp down on out-of-control coaches. They weren't and I never went back. This year the same program was looking for officials and asked me to try to get some from my association. I conveniently forgot to pass the message along.

Usually programs like that get newer officials or people in it for the bucks who don't know how to handle the situation or don't care as long as they're paid cash at the field.

On another topic, the WH has no business changing the call to a sideline warning or inferring that the OP "missed" a timeout request. If I come in and tell a WH I have USC on the head coach, I expect it's going to be enforced. And this comes from a guy who *is* a varsity WH.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

I choose to work youth games only where the coaches are in control.

Not something I can control in most situations. Even if I could, there is someone that does not get it.

Peace