Taking A Knee

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

NEVER tell the defense what to do. Go into EVERY kneeling situation as if the offense is going to fake it. This might only happen to you once in a lifetime, or never, but if you aren't ready and/or you've told the defense what to do, then any fallout is your fault.

AT MOST - tell them something like, "If they take a knee, no nonsense." Or "Don't hit anyone after the whistle, boys." AT MOST.

At youth ball, you might want to be more specific, but unless the league has a sportsmanship rule forbidding fake knee-plays, you better preface your warning with IF.

"Never" and "Every" ???

When's the last time you saw a 56-6 game end with the offense taking a knee and the defense going balls out to make the tackle?

You don't see it because the officials told the guys that "they are taking a knee."

When the situation calls for the announcement, announce it.

If you don't know if the siutation calls for it, then you have a lot of work to do.

[kdf5]

Originally Posted by asdf

"Never" and "Every" ???

When's the last time you saw a 56-6 game end with the offense taking a knee and the defense going balls out to make the tackle?

You don't because the officials told the guys that "they are taking a knee."

When the situation calls for the announcement, announce it.

If you don't know if the siutation calls for it, then you have a lot of work to do.

It's not our job to tell players what to do or to help coach. It's our job to apply the rules. If a team fakes a kneel down that is not our responsibility nor our fault and if a kid hauls off and whacks someone or otherwise does something wrong or flagrant THEN we go into action.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by kdf5

It's not our job to tell players what to do or to help coach. It's our job to apply the rules. If a team fakes a kneel down that is not our responsibility nor our fault and if a kid hauls off and whacks someone or otherwise does something wrong or flagrant THEN we go into action.

Preventative Officiating

If the game's been chippy and the you know that's it's a kneel down situation, yet you let the above happen without some prior notification..... then you should be relegated to working 2nd grade ball in a two-man system.

[kdf5]

Originally Posted by asdf

Preventative Officiating

If the game's been chippy and the you know that's it's a kneel down situation, yet you let the above happen without some prior notification..... then you should be relegated to working 2nd grade ball in a two-man system.

And if you've done your job correctly in the other 47 minutes, which I know is impossible for you, then you shouldn't have to be doing something you haven't done all game long, which is trying to rein in the game when it's too late and letting the other team know what's about to happen.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by kdf5

And if you've done your job correctly in the other 47 minutes, which I know is impossible for you, then you shouldn't have to be doing something you haven't done all game long, which is trying to rein in the game when it's too late and letting the other team know what's about to happen.

I did not realize that I was conversing with an official that has knows when, where and how a fight is going to break out. You should write a book, because you have all the answers.

While I take the time do do some preventative officiating, you keep spotting the ball two inches outside of the 10 yard line on a long gain....

Because after all, that's what the rule says.

[kdf5]

Originally Posted by asdf

I did not realize that I was conversing with an official that has knows when, where and how a fight is going to break out. You should write a book, because you have all the answers.

While I take the time do do some preventative officiating, you keep spotting the ball two inches outside of the 10 yard line on a long gain....

Because after all, that's what the rule says.

What I know that you don't is that preventative officiating starts at the initial kickoff, not the last 35 seconds of the game like you think. I also know English..... "that has knows when".... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot is that?

[asdf]

Originally Posted by kdf5

What I know that you don't is that preventative officiating starts at the initial kickoff, not the last 35 seconds of the game like you think. I also know English..... "that has knows when".... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot is that?

Who said anything about waiting until 35 seconds left in the game to get involved.

Anyone worth their salt is talking to the kids (preventative officiating) throughout the game.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by asdf

Preventative Officiating

If the game's been chippy and the you know that's it's a kneel down situation, yet you let the above happen without some prior notification..... then you should be relegated to working 2nd grade ball in a two-man system.

Not really sure what you're saying here... are you implying that in a chippy 56-6 game, suddenly the team up by 50 is unable to block on a kneel down play? PF or USC would still be PF or USC - our "warning" notwithstanding.

[asdf]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

Not really sure what you're saying here... are you implying that in a chippy 56-6 game, suddenly the team up by 50 is unable to block on a kneel down play? PF or USC would still be PF or USC - our "warning" notwithstanding.

Please expalin to me how many times on TV in either the pros or in a college game you see teams actively blocking or defending a no brainer kneel down at the end of the game?

You don't see it , and you won't see it.

And the reason being is the guys, you are a helluva lot better than we'll ever be, are telling them that "it's a knee".

The players know what to do when they hear that.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by asdf

Please expalin to me how many times on TV in either the pros or in a college game you see teams actively blocking or defending a no brainer kneel down at the end of the game?

You don't see it , and you won't see it.

And the reason being is the guys, you are a helluva lot better than we'll ever be, are telling them that "it's a knee".

The players know what to do when they hear that.

I know for a fact you are dead wrong. Those players know what's coming, and on MOST occasions don't actively block or defend because they know there's a FAR lower chance of any of the things we've mentioned happening. I PROMISE you there are no college officials or NFL officials telling anyone on the field that the offense is taking a knee. To suggest otherwise throws everything else you've ever said into doubt. You could not be more wrong. (And, on this rare occasion, I suspect even JR will agree with me)

[BroKen62]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

I know for a fact you are dead wrong. Those players know what's coming, and on MOST occasions don't actively block or defend because they know there's a FAR lower chance of any of the things we've mentioned happening. I PROMISE you there are no college officials or NFL officials telling anyone on the field that the offense is taking a knee. To suggest otherwise throws everything else you've ever said into doubt. You could not be more wrong. (And, on this rare occasion, I suspect even JR will agree with me)

I agree. We had this exact same thing happen last night in a JV game. I was running umpire, team a came up in victory formation, I said nothing. B shot the gap, creamed the QB after his knee was down, we flagged him for a PF, marked off 15. Everybody must have got the message, because the next 2 snaps were clean, game over, band played, cheerleaders cheered, and we all went home.

[chymechowder]

Originally Posted by asdf

Preventative Officiating

If the game's been chippy and the you know that's it's a kneel down situation, yet you let the above happen without some prior notification..... then you should be relegated to working 2nd grade ball in a two-man system.

Do you do that with each guy on a wing? Or do you go ref/umpire?

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by chymechowder

Do you do that with each guy on a wing? Or do you go ref/umpire?

I know you're kidding, but I've seen both, and hybrids. Personally, the kiddo league I do runs a HL and a R/LJ. Ref counts and makes sure they are set correctly (they have bizarro rules about where the defenders have to start), then starts cheating toward his sideline, watching for initial interior holding and then acting like LJ the rest of the play (HL responsible for LOS infractions all the way across). Worked one very long day with R and U - too much running. HL and LJ, I bet EVERYONE was holding in the middle... I'll never know from there.

[kdf5]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

I know you're kidding, but I've seen both, and hybrids. Personally, the kiddo league I do runs a HL and a R/LJ. Ref counts and makes sure they are set correctly (they have bizarro rules about where the defenders have to start), then starts cheating toward his sideline, watching for initial interior holding and then acting like LJ the rest of the play (HL responsible for LOS infractions all the way across). Worked one very long day with R and U - too much running. HL and LJ, I bet EVERYONE was holding in the middle... I'll never know from there.

I did a JV game once by myself. No one else showed up. It was the best game I was ever involved in from the standpoint of sportsmanship. Early in the game there was either a false start or an encroachment. I told them that I had no clue. They all laughed and we had a do-over. They didn't make a peep and played hard and clean and shagged balls for me and helped each other off the ground. I'm glad it happened. Those kids were more polite and had more fun and it was a cleaner game than I've ever seen.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by kdf5

I did a JV game once by myself. No one else showed up. It was the best game I was ever involved in from the standpoint of sportsmanship. Early in the game there was either a false start or an encroachment. I told them that I had no clue. They all laughed and we had a do-over. They didn't make a peep and played hard and clean and shagged balls for me and helped each other off the ground. I'm glad it happened. Those kids were more polite and had more fun and it was a cleaner game than I've ever seen.

Sounds almost like what we had to do when we were kids, playing in a neighbor's yard, with zero officials.