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Facemask on the runner?
I was watching the Indiana v Western Ky game... the IU running back is running down the field and the WKU player moves in to make the tackle and of course here comes the stiffarm.
Except in this case the runners hands are in the facemask of the WKU player and he has shoved the helmet nearly 90 degrees and up to the point of the chin guard was under the WKU players nose and pushing it up even more. The Louisville Courier Journal had a great shot of the play. It was obvious during the game, and even more blatantly obvious in the photo.. Over my 20+ years I have called facemask on the runner maybe 2 or 3 times, and each time the coach went nuts, telling me you can not call that on the runner. What say the rest of you? Have some of you made that call? Is it a call that should not be made? |
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I haven't called it before but what you describe does not sound like a facemask foul. There needs to be a grasping of the facemask or helmet opening and a pull or twist for there to be a foul. An open hand does not meet the criteria.
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Even if you’re on the right track, you’ll get run over if you just sit there. - Will Rogers |
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Found a photo
Look and see what you think..
Indiana at WKU | courier-journal.com | Louisville Kentuckiana Colleges | The Courier-Journal Last edited by ShadowRef; Mon Sep 20, 2010 at 12:13pm. Reason: spelling correction |
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Still photos are often dangerous to rule on for officials since they don't tell the whole picture (pun intended). I'll comment on what I see here. It looks like he has his hand on the bottom of the face mask and is pushing up. I don't see an obvious "grasp" of the face mask which is required for a foul. That doesn't mean there wasn't a grasp before or after this but I don't see enough in this picture to say this was an obvious miss.
Also, if the defender's helmet was properly fitted, this kind of contact would not push the helmet off so easily. We are seeing more and more helmets coming off in games because they are not wearing them propely. They shouldn't be so easy to put on and remove. |
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In the above photo, I'll say that there's a good chance that this was a facemask by A.
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Pope Francis |
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Only time I've called this, both were runners grasping the facemask and throwing the defender straight down by pulling on the facemask.
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I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'” West Houston Mike |
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Pope Francis |
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I was thinking of the immortal words of Socrates, who said, 'I drank what?'” West Houston Mike |
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I would like to see the whole play or see several pictures before I can say that was absolutely the right call. Then again that is why still pictures are not very good to determine fouls. That is just a very brief time compared to several seconds that help make these calls in real life.
Also I have seen this at least once a season. I think with the gloves players us now and the nature of the material, you see payers not able to get their hand off of the mask as easy. Also I think a lot of technique is off and I am seeing this more. Runners used to be taught to kind of "strike" with the stiff arm and know players keep their arm out there and the mask will be grabbed even if it is not intentional. In the picture the runner has a glove on and it is clear the pinky got caught up in the mask. But whether that is a foul or not is up for debate. Peace
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Let us get into "Good Trouble." ----------------------------------------------------------- Charles Michael “Mick” Chambers (1947-2010) |
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Exactly. And this is not a "no doubter." He's pushing against the mask, open handed. I got nothing.
Also, there are no 5 yarders under NCAA rules.
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"...as cool as the other side of the pillow." - Stuart Scott "You should never be proud of doing the right thing." - Dean Smith |
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Is facemasking an opponent with only the pinky finger a technique being coached in the US?
American players must have pretty strong pinky fingers. But to be serious, you can't judge 100% from a still photo. This photo could just as easily show the end of a facemask foul as it could a legal straight arm.
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Sorry Death, you lose.... It was Professor Plum! |
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I've had it about the same number of times, with the same result. In each case, the runner either pulled the defender down by the mask, or twisted his hand at the wrist to turn the defender aside.
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A stiff arm that is stiff before contact is legal. I stiff arms that becomes stiff after hitting the facemask/head area is a foul.
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Pope Francis |
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