Hurdling

[jTheUmp]

I'm the umpire on jRod37's crew.

No, we were not on ESPN yesterday... I'm pretty sure ESPN wouldn't broadcast a 56-0 game.

As I remember seeing the play, the B player was upright, with only his feet touching the ground, in a good "breakdown" position ready to make the tackle.

I had two reactions: "Wow, I can't believe he managed to jump over the defender like that", followed almost immediately by "isn't that considered hurdling?"

If/when we do get a hold of the game tape, this is one of the plays I definitely want to review.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by jTheUmp

I'm the umpire on jRod37's crew.

No, we were not on ESPN yesterday... I'm pretty sure ESPN wouldn't broadcast a 56-0 game.

Not the whole game - just the hurdling highlight on Top Plays.

[Welpe]

Aaa cmathews said, don't get too wrapped up in the pose if the runner. The rule is written so that a head first dive or similar over an opponent is legal. What you need to be concerned with is the feet or knees. If those are leading the way then you probably have a foul. Think of the way a track hurdler goes over hurdles, same thing really.

But, be knowing. You probably won't see it again for a long time but you will be ready.

[Eastshire]

If a player who is running jumps over anything and lands on his feet and continues to run, short of doing a somersault in the air, I'm having a hard time seeing how he could lead with anything other than a foot or a knee.

Any way of leading with the upper body would put you seriously off-balance, making it difficult to keep your feet let alone continue running. Obviously it's difficult to know without seeing the play, but given he ran an additional 20 yards, I think it's very likely he had to have hurdled the player.

[Canned Heat]

Originally Posted by Eastshire

If a player who is running jumps over anything and lands on his feet and continues to run, short of doing a somersault in the air, I'm having a hard time seeing how he could lead with anything other than a foot or a knee.

Any way of leading with the upper body would put you seriously off-balance, making it difficult to keep your feet let alone continue running. Obviously it's difficult to know without seeing the play, but given he ran an additional 20 yards, I think it's very likely he had to have hurdled the player.

He literally "hurdled" the player and did have a lead leg in doing so. The B player, who looked to be a DB was in position and was hung out to dry but standing totally upright and the runner jumped and completely cleared the DB. I have yet to ever see a play where a ball carrier cleared any kind of height like that. It was like Walter Payton doing his famous leap over the D-line...except landing on his feet.

[MD Longhorn]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

He literally "hurdled" the player and did have a lead leg in doing so. The B player, who looked to be a DB was in position and was hung out to dry but standing totally upright and the runner jumped and completely cleared the DB. I have yet to ever see a play where a ball carrier cleared any kind of height like that. It was like Walter Payton doing his famous leap over the D-line...except landing on his feet.

The reason he cleared him is the same as the reason I think this was not a foul. He did not lead with the knees or feet. His legs were spread. If they hadn't been, he would definitely have kneed this guy in the helmet - he didn't jump literally 6 feet up. He spread his legs and went over the defender as if dunking a ball, and then kept running.

[JRod37]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

The reason he cleared him is the same as the reason I think this was not a foul. He did not lead with the knees or feet. His legs were spread. If they hadn't been, he would definitely have kneed this guy in the helmet - he didn't jump literally 6 feet up. He spread his legs and went over the defender as if dunking a ball, and then kept running.

I suppose it depends on your definition of "foremost". Does foremost assume "downfield"? Is foremost simply in any direction from the player parallel to the ground? Is foremost assume in the direction that the player is running/moving? If so, is it possible to hurdle if you just jump straight up and come straight back down? If foremost does mean downfield, then is it possible to hurdle if you're running towards your own goal line? Remember, it doesn't HAVE to be the runner. It's any player or non-player.

I'm not saying it was or wasn't. These are just some things that came to me as I was thinking about the situation where a player does a spread eagle like in the play you're talking about.

[Umpmazza]

Originally Posted by mbcrowder

The reason he cleared him is the same as the reason I think this was not a foul. He did not lead with the knees or feet. His legs were spread. If they hadn't been, he would definitely have kneed this guy in the helmet - he didn't jump literally 6 feet up. He spread his legs and went over the defender as if dunking a ball, and then kept running.

what I dont understand is why all of th talk ' he lead with his knee's".. the rule says

Rule(s):
Rule 2, Section 22: Hurdling
Hurdling is an attempt by a player to jump (hurdle) with one or both feet or knees foremost over an opponent who is contacting the ground with no part of his body except one or both feet.

maybe I am misreading this. To me it almost seems like a hurdling call.. but this is a HTBT play.

[Texas Aggie]

JRut is an expert on hurdling calls. Ask him.