Crew and Referee Mechanics - Penalty Enforcement

[john_faz]

I am looking for some tips on the steps to go through when administering penalties. As the Referee on my newly formed crew, I feel we are hurrying too much and are not communicating properly with the sidelines and captains. Any suggestions?

I have seen the R/U/Wings meet at the dead ball spot to discuss the enforcement. Is this standard procedure?

When and where do you give the preliminary signal?

Does it change if the R is the one who called the foul?

What should the other crew members (5 man) being doing during this time?

Thanks for your help.

[BroKen62]

Originally Posted by john_faz

I am looking for some tips on the steps to go through when administering penalties. As the Referee on my newly formed crew, I feel we are hurrying too much and are not communicating properly with the sidelines and captains. Any suggestions?

I have seen the R/U/Wings meet at the dead ball spot to discuss the enforcement. Is this standard procedure?

When and where do you give the preliminary signal?

Does it change if the R is the one who called the foul?

What should the other crew members (5 man) being doing during this time?

Thanks for your help.

From a LJ's perspective, when I have a foul, I go to the R, who is coming toward me, and I tell him what I have. The BJ holds the spot of my flag, the U holds the spot where down ended, and the HL takes a water break. Then, if it's basic, the R goes to the U, tells him what to mark off, and there we go. If there's a question, or something WH doesn't understand, he'll call everybody in and we'll discuss it.

[Rich]

As a crew, we want to make sure everyone is on the same page during a penalty.

As a R, I usually run to the flag unless there are flags thrown by both wings, in which case we'll meet at the umpire. I'd rather have the official stay close to his flag rather than have him abandon his flag to find me.

We want the flag covered, the enforcement spot covered, and the succeeding spot covered. Usually, the BJ will cover the flag unless it's his flag and he'll record the penalty. The LJ goes to the enforcement spot, the L goes to the succeeding spot. Then the U moves the football. If the L and the U have different spots, we can go back to the LJ to make sure we have the right spot.

This requires communication so *everyone* on the crew knows what's happening. If you go too fast, that doesn't happen. And you'll make fewer mistakes if everyone is working during penalty enforcement.

[HLin NC]

If the foul is away from my zone, I will cover the flag of the calling official.

If I have the dead ball spot, I will hold the spot until relieved by the U. I will also hold the spot if I am the calling official and await the R to discuss the foul.

The U, R, and myself will discuss down and distance and then I mark off the yardage along the sideline in concert with U to the succeeding spot. The LJ holds the previous spot.

I don't recall getting a water break

If you think you're going too fast, you probably are. While we all want to keep up the pace of the game, rushing through penalty admin is not the best way to go about it.

[ump33]

We use penalty mechanics very similar to what HLin NC describes:

> 1st priority is the dead ball spot; we make sure that it is covered.
> Next we make sure that the flag is covered. Sometimes that gets tricky based on which official called the foul.
> Hopefully the U (with the next football) and calling official are free to meet with the R to determine enforcement
> U moves to enforcement spot and waits for HL to move to corresponding spot on sideline and signals 1 finger for 5 yds, 2 fingers for 10 yds, 3 fingers for 15 yds and crossed arms for half the distance penalties.
> U and HL walk off the appropriate yardage
> If possible, the LJ will stand at the “enforcement yard line” until the U and HL confirm the ball has been placed at the correct yard line.

It may sound like a lot of unnecessary movement, but it actually moves quite smooth. And to agree with HLin NC, there are no water breaks in this “checks and balance system.”

[whitehat]

Some good mechanics stated.
I will add that as R I give the prelim signal as soon as the flagging official tells me what he has. then we start sorting it out.

When giving choices to captain I always start with the same phrase: "If you decline the penalty..."

A good terminal official will see the prelim signal, and if he knows the enforcements like he is supposed to he can be very helpful if the coach is close by in telling him what's up. eg. "coach, looks like an illegal forward pass, that's going to be a loss of down and 5 yards from the spot..." etc.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by john_faz

I have seen the R/U/Wings meet at the dead ball spot to discuss the enforcement. Is this standard procedure?

You have to have those two talk so they know which way to walk off the penalty. I do not know what you are looking for, but I think it would be necessary as the U is likely not aware of the foul that is called by other officials all the time.

Originally Posted by john_faz

When and where do you give the preliminary signal?

In an open space after the foul is reported to you.

Originally Posted by john_faz

Does it change if the R is the one who called the foul?

Not really.

Originally Posted by john_faz

What should the other crew members (5 man) being doing during this time?

Depends on the play. Crew members should be doing something. Someone should mark off the foul with the U. Someone should cover the foul spot and dead ball spot if they are different. The wing should tell the team the number or position the foul was called on.

Peace

[With_Two_Flakes]

If you are holding the dead ball spot, don't leave it! Make the R come to you (unless someone can hold the spot for you). NEVER assume a pen will be accepted and therefore you dont need that spot.

If you have a flag, toot your whistle once the play is dead to let the rest of the crew know. That includes the R if he threw the flag. The most important guy is actually the HL to make sure he freezes the chains. Most flags are marched from the prev spot so make sure you still have it.

If there are multiple flags, talk! NEVER assume the other guy saw the same foul as you, he might have something different. If you have the same foul, just needs one of you to go tell the R.

When and where do you give the preliminary signal?
Always give it as early as you can. The coach wants to know what the foul is and whether it's against him or not, so he can think about what play to call next. Also many coaches want to be able to shout/signal in to their captain to accept or decline. If you don't give a prelim, you take away that help from a young man who may well need it.
Some fouls are obvious as to whether they will be accepted and only warrant one signal eg a false start, an offensive hold on a run that made big yardage, etc.

One final word on signals. Your signals are too quick. Everyone's signals are too quick... Watch yourself on film, you'll be surprised how much faster your signals are than you think they actually are. Practice in the mirror at home.


Does it change if the R is the one who called the foul?
Nope. Stick to the same routine, but obviously you miss out the foul being reported to you as you called it. Toot your whistle, tell the U what youve got so he can bale you out of trouble if you are about to screw up.

What should the other crew members (5 man) be doing during this time?
Covering spots, covering flags, relaying in a ball. When the U actually marks it off, I want my LJ at the enf spot and the HL to mirror the U to check he goes the right distance.
Make sure the rest of your crew understand that you want them to come in as soon as they think you and the Ump have messed it up. You don't want them to start talking about it on the ride home after the game. Better to look bad but at least get it right on the night.


A personal preference of mine is not to announce numbers on fouls. I work mostly adult rec games in the UK and Europe and they get a bit more fiesty than the High School and College I've done in the US. My philosophy is not to yell out numbers and so set a guy up for retaliation the next play. I'll get the wing guy to give the number to the sideline so his coach knows who messed up.

[BroKen62]

This has been a great post and learning experience. As you can tell from my post, we've been just wandering around with no purpose. Our pregame Friday night will be what everybody is supposed to do on penalties. Thanks!!!

[Rich]

Originally Posted by With_Two_Flakes

If there are multiple flags, talk! NEVER assume the other guy saw the same foul as you, he might have something different. If you have the same foul, just needs one of you to go tell the R.

Yup. BJ/LJ both have a flag on a passing play. Probably DPI. I'm heading in their direction, but I want them to have the conversation before I get there. If I get there and they're still talking, I wait -- I don't want to influence it or look like I am.

If we have fouls where the spot is important and two officials throw flags, *they* need to decide which spot is proper and only they move their flags and I'd like this to be done before I talk to them as well.

I'm going to cover this and measurements at the next association meeting.

[whitehat]

Just wondering at what point signals for R will no longer be necessary. That is, especially in NFL and College where all R's are "miked" up.
In HS I can certainly see retaining signals as only a few games in larger venues do I have a microphone on me.

I can see signals practical between officials to let each other know what they have...

Just seems a bit useless and redundant for R to tell everyone over the PA system what he has while flailing his arms around...

[HLin NC]

Actually signals will probably never go away. They will be useful on the game video for coaches and evaluators as they usually don't have audio or mute it.

[With_Two_Flakes]

Originally Posted by HLin NC

Actually signals will probably never go away. They will be useful on the game video for coaches and evaluators as they usually don't have audio or mute it.

I don't use the mike on my prelim, I just signal. I only use the mike on my final signal.

[Eastshire]

Originally Posted by whitehat

Just wondering at what point signals for R will no longer be necessary. That is, especially in NFL and College where all R's are "miked" up.
In HS I can certainly see retaining signals as only a few games in larger venues do I have a microphone on me.

I can see signals practical between officials to let each other know what they have...

Just seems a bit useless and redundant for R to tell everyone over the PA system what he has while flailing his arms around...

Microphones don't always work, but we can always see the hand signals.