Defensive calls Illegal...?

[bisonlj]

Worked a game last year where ball was snapped to QB in shot gun who was obviously not ready for the ball. Ball was recovered by defense. Coach for A argued that defense was barking signals that caused the snapper to snap the ball. From the U position it was impossible to discern any signals since both teams were calling things up until the snap. It happened again later in the game but caused a false start this time. I still didn't hear anything so couldn't flag it. I did tell the defensive line that if anyone is doing what the other was saying they were doing and I caught it, they would get a 15-yard USC penalty. One of the brain donors on the line said, "OK guys, stop doing that." UGGHH...he admitted to doing it which almost made me more mad! I've talked to several officials about it and they agreed it would be pretty hard to catch that but you have to get it if you hear it.

[ajmc]

I believe the key comment in the case book play included earlier is, "If in the official's judgment the action by B1 was for the purpose of disconcerting or hindering A, it is an unsportsmanlike conduct foul."

If you want to put up with a never ending escalation of nonsense, you can ignore this silliness, otherwise you can choose to put a stop to it, either by letting the linemen, on both teams, know in uncertain terms it's unacceptable or, if necessary, flagging someone.

[bigjohn]

I have told officials, The defense can't use those tactics and been told. "Sure they can coach, that is football".

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

I have told officials, The defense can't use those tactics and been told. "Sure they can coach, that is football".

I wouldn't know how to make it any clearer than, "in the official's judgment".

[bigjohn]

Which clearly means, "it is called differently, every Friday night!" Just depends on what kind of official is making that judgment call. That my friend is called, inconsistency and that is what drives coaches crazy!

[Welpe]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

=That my friend is called, inconsistency and that is what drives coaches crazy!

Well that's what happens when you using human beings as officials. Someone has to make the judgment whether or not an act is illegal. We can use rules an philosophy but we still have to apply our judgment. That is what we get paid to do.

John, I still think you would benefit from seeing some snaps as an official. My this discussion seems familiar.

[bigjohn]

The problem is that oftentimes a guy's philosophy of football impairs his judgment of the rules and interpretations as written.

I think I would do just fine as an official and may do just that when I no longer am a coach. I will retire from teaching and coaching in 5 years and plan to do just that.

[Welpe]

I wouldn't be so quick to discount it...I thought the same thing when I was a coach.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Which clearly means, "it is called differently, every Friday night!" Just depends on what kind of official is making that judgment call. That my friend is called, inconsistency and that is what drives coaches crazy!

Have you ever considered that rather than the inconsistency driving you crazy, it's your expectation that things that happen in different games, between different teams and players, under different circumstances and conditions would some how be rigidly consistent, that's causing your agita?

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

The problem is that oftentimes a guy's philosophy of football impairs his judgment of the rules and interpretations as written.

I think I would do just fine as an official and may do just that when I no longer am a coach. I will retire from teaching and coaching in 5 years and plan to do just that.

You have a lot of serious things taking place in your games. I rarely ever hear the defense give signals that at all can be confused with the offense. Dude, what kind of cheap football do you guys play in Ohio?

Peace

[bigjohn]

Whatever, Rut. Like that cheap crap doesn't happen in ILL. They just have fights and get banned for the season.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

Whatever, Rut. Like that cheap crap doesn't happen in ILL. They just have fights and get banned for the season.

I never said it does not happen, but it does not happen every game or even every other game. You claim a bunch of stuff happens every game that most of us hardly see in a single season. If it is not this, it is butt blocking and tackling, then intentional grounding. I do not even hear coaches complaining about these things the way you do.

And yes there was a fight and there was a kid that died of an asthma attack that same Friday and neither happened in my games. I would not say those were common occurrences. But if they happen once in your game, to you they happen all the time.

Peace

[bigjohn]

I have never said all things happen in just my games. I see a lot of games and have been doing this a long time, Mr Official. I see 3 to 5 scouting tapes a week and see clips from games all over the state via the internet.

[mbyron]

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by bigjohn

I have never said all things happen in just my games. I see a lot of games and have been doing this a long time, Mr Official. I see 3 to 5 scouting tapes a week and see clips from games all over the state via the internet.

Let me get this straight, you get videos that have enough sound to hear what players are saying to each other? I mean it is difficult to hear NFL and college games with much more technology to know what is being said directly on the field all the time. Even if you saw tape, I find it hard to believe that there are defenses doing this all the time to the point they are violating the rules. Defense can call signals out to each other that is legal. And I have never heard a coach complain that they saw this on tape and this was something we needed to watch out for. Now when it comes to low blocks or hitting someone out of the play, I heard that from time to time. Never head someone claim this was done after they watched the tape.

Peace