Video on new website.

[Warrenkicker]

I agree this was a hurdle. Some may be technically correct in saying that his knee was on the ground when the runner went over the tackler but the intent of the runner was to hurdle the tackler no matter his position. We have been shown the principle of a block below the waist is illegal even if the blockee gets his hands on the blocker first because the blocker committed to going low and the actions of the blockee shouldn't make the blocker's actions legal. In this situation I believe we should use the same reasoning. If a runner was going toward the LOS and there was a pile of linemen there and he hurdled them I believe this is legal per the rule. Out in the open field the runner should not be attempting to jump over another player in this manner.

But saying that I do know of Rs in my area that have said, "I'm not going to be the first one to call that." during a game which is the same thing as "pioneer" call. That was for helping the runner but if you won't call one you might not call the other. I have seen on TV highlights a blatant hurdle right over a defender and he was only bent at the waist and nothing was called.

As for the quarterfinal game, did you actually check any cleats for length in pregame? R made a statement about defusing the situation about the cleat length with what could have turned out to be a lie. Him saying that and possibly not following through could be as bad and just wiping off a personal foul that really wasn't his to overrule.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Warrenkicker

As for the quarterfinal game, did you actually check any cleats for length in pregame? R made a statement about defusing the situation about the cleat length with what could have turned out to be a lie. Him saying that and possibly not following through could be as bad and just wiping off a personal foul that really wasn't his to overrule.

There was a game earlier in the year where a team admitted to wearing illegal cleats after the game was over (not our game). It was the front page of a media paper story. Some mom's went out and bought longer cleats than the rules allowed and no one mentioned it during the game and was only discovered after the fact. So this is what he was referring to and many crews talked about how we were not going looking for this issue. In other words, a coach would have to make it an issue and we are not checking every player to determine if the cleats used were a centimeter longer than rules allowed.

Peace

[bossman72]

The WH seemed to imply that "Yes, your call of hurdling was correct, but we're not going to call that because it will be a very unpopular call and I think it's a stupid rule. Best to waive it off and avoid the confrontation."

[waltjp]

Jeff, I only watched the Hurdling clip and I believe you nailed it.

[Texas Aggie]

"You're (ore we're) not calling that" is something that might get one of our guys before the board or ethics committee. Perhaps it happens on established crews where guys know each other well and we never hear about it, but I would never, ever, say anywhere close to that.

What is the Fed rule here, btw? What I saw was legal in the NCAA rules.

[Welpe]

Aggie, in Fed, hurdling is defined as:

Hurdling is an attempt by a player to jump (hurdle) with one or both feet or knees foremost over an opponent who is contacting the ground with no part of his body except one or both feet.

As you can see, in Fed, the runner is not exempt from hurdling.

[TXMike]

Yep, legal in NCAA.

What is a "pioneer call"?

[chymechowder]

Originally Posted by Welpe

Aggie, in Fed, hurdling is defined as:

As you can see, in Fed, the runner is not exempt from hurdling.

actually, I can't see that the Fed runner is not exempt. not from your quote of the Fed rules anyway.

you gave the definiton of hurdling (which is, practically speaking, identical to the ncaa's). but you didn't quote the Fed rule against hurdling.

my point being that the ncaa definition makes no mention of the exemption either. we don't get the exemption until 9-1-2-i:

There shall be no hurdling (Exception: The ball carrier may hurdle an opponent.).

Any chance there actually is a Fed exception? No disrespect or second-guessing intended! I mention this only b/c I've worked games with Mass. officials who flagged the ballcarrier for hurdling. When we got together, they were aware of the definition, but not of the exception.