American Flag on Your Uniform....

[Canned Heat]

We can have a pi$$ing match about this all day if you want. You and several others don't care for them...I and several other officials do.

I like them, I think they're decent and professional looking, and add a little class, maybe even a bit of pride, respect, or authority to the uniform as a whole. Something that is seriously missing in society when you see all of the flack and incidents that are happening between refs/umps and fans, players and such.

Obviously, you don't get why me or any of my crew want to wear them either. It's not about how much work it is to have your wife, sister, mom, or sporting goods store put a patch on your shirt(s). Getting a patch sewn on, temp glued, or velcroed on by yourself takes about as much energy as it does to get out of bed....or to get into position or out of the way when a play is coming right at you, for that matter.

I came here looking for in-depth insight to various areas of officiating certain sports, to share some things that I've seen over 15 years of officiating, and to bounce questions off of some others that have worked their sports long enough to give a concise, common, and correct answer to anything I may have an interest in and to see what others have witnessed over the course of their careers. A good portion of you guys seem like you're out for an argument rather than trying to point someone in the right direction. Maybe some of you should be coaching or in the stands instead, where you apparently see it all.

[JRutledge]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

We can have a pi$$ing match about this all day if you want. You and several others don't care for them...I and several other officials do.

I like them, I think they're decent and professional looking, and add a little class, maybe even a bit of pride, respect, or authority to the uniform as a whole. Something that is seriously missing in society when you see all of the flack and incidents that are happening between refs/umps and fans, players and such.

Obviously, you don't get why me or any of my crew want to wear them either. It's not about how much work it is to have your wife, sister, mom, or sporting goods store put a patch on your shirt(s). Getting a patch sewn on, temp glued, or velcroed on by yourself takes about as much energy as it does to get out of bed....or to get into position or out of the way when a play is coming right at you, for that matter.

I came here looking for in-depth insight to various areas of officiating certain sports, to share some things that I've seen over 15 years of officiating, and to bounce questions off of some others that have worked their sports long enough to give a concise, common, and correct answer to anything I may have an interest in and to see what others have witnessed over the course of their careers. A good portion of you guys seem like you're out for an argument rather than trying to point someone in the right direction. Maybe some of you should be coaching or in the stands instead, where you apparently see it all.

You made a statement that people here have the right to disagree with. And it is completely in the right for people to question you one why you feel that way. If that is a problem, then a discussion board is not going to be for you, because that is what we do here is debate several issues and that does include what we put on our uniforms. I personally wear a flag on my uniform and it is optional. Just about everyone does it where I live, because when 9-11 took place, it was obvious football season. Those around here, starting wearing flags on our jersey (which there was not standard policy if I remember correctly before that time) around that time and did not wear them before that incident. We have done it ever since, but I do not know if it is useful or appropriate. And that is why on every other sport I work. I do not wear a flag at all. I will do it only because the crew and most crews do it in football. But if someone does not put one on their jersey, it is no skin off my back. It was a legitimate question to ask you why you feel that way and you still have not answered the question. I think wearing a flag does not make you more patriotic or is something that needs to be displayed on a uniform of non-governmental people like officials are in their role during games. We are independent contactors and only working because our states allow us to work. Flags to me are not necessary for our jobs. And when you say they should be mandatory, people want to know why considering that even the government suggest that the proper display of flags are not to go on uniforms.

Peace

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

We can have a pi$$ing match about this all day if you want. You and several others don't care for them...I and several other officials do.

I like them, I think they're decent and professional looking, and add a little class, maybe even a bit of pride, respect, or authority to the uniform as a whole. Something that is seriously missing in society when you see all of the flack and incidents that are happening between refs/umps and fans, players and such.

Obviously, you don't get why me or any of my crew want to wear them either. It's not about how much work it is to have your wife, sister, mom, or sporting goods store put a patch on your shirt(s). Getting a patch sewn on, temp glued, or velcroed on by yourself takes about as much energy as it does to get out of bed....or to get into position or out of the way when a play is coming right at you, for that matter.

I came here looking for in-depth insight to various areas of officiating certain sports, to share some things that I've seen over 15 years of officiating, and to bounce questions off of some others that have worked their sports long enough to give a concise, common, and correct answer to anything I may have an interest in and to see what others have witnessed over the course of their careers. A good portion of you guys seem like you're out for an argument rather than trying to point someone in the right direction. Maybe some of you should be coaching or in the stands instead, where you apparently see it all.

Some of us have been here for a decade or near to it and ask questions about OFFICIATING and talk about OFFICIATING. You've made 9 posts and most of them have to do with a flag patch and nothing to do with officiating. Maybe someone else should be in the stands.

[Canned Heat]

Point is Rich, I came looking for advice. I got advice and then I also got what I consider more of a chastising because I was for the flags. I have no qualms whatsoever with anyone questioning my reasons. I cut my teeth in reffing back in my early twenties with a man that was Chief of Police in my city. He was also a highly decorated vet from the Vietnam War. In his last year of officiating, also the year of the 9/11 tragedy, we thought we would honor him to a degree, and our country....something I apparently need to defend to some of the guys who have responded today. I took over that same crew and over a few years have added some great crew members who also happen to be military veterans with one currently being a police officer. We thought it would be a nice touch to add.

I can tell you that back in 2001 when we wore the flag for the remainder of that season, people would comment on how much they thought the flags looked great and how they looked a part of the uniform.

I can tell by your comments alone that many a good official have probably walked away from this forum due to pure attitude. If I didn't have to defend a simple 2"x3" flag to the bitter end like a cornered pit bull, you're right I'd have about 4 total posts. And you having 10 years of seniority on one of probably 20 or more different officiating forums across the country makes you obviously the best official here or anywhere.

I'll stop by now again to look at or address something I may come across. In the meantime, I look forward to seeing you working the big game next February. You're obviously far and away the cream of the crop...at least from WI, anyway.

[Rich]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

Point is Rich, I came looking for advice. I got advice and then I also got what I consider more of a chastising because I was for the flags. I have no qualms whatsoever with anyone questioning my reasons. I cut my teeth in reffing back in my early twenties with a man that was Chief of Police in my city. He was also a highly decorated vet from the Vietnam War. In his last year of officiating, also the year of the 9/11 tragedy, we thought we would honor him to a degree, and our country....something I apparently need to defend to some of the guys who have responded today. I took over that same crew and over a few years have added some great crew members who also happen to be military veterans with one currently being a police officer. We thought it would be a nice touch to add.

I can tell you that back in 2001 when we wore the flag for the remainder of that season, people would comment on how much they thought the flags looked great and how they looked a part of the uniform.

I can tell by your comments alone that many a good official have probably walked away from this forum due to pure attitude. If I didn't have to defend a simple 2"x3" flag to the bitter end like a cornered pit bull, you're right I'd have about 4 total posts. And you having 10 years of seniority on one of probably 20 or more different officiating forums across the country makes you obviously the best official here or anywhere.

I'll stop by now again to look at or address something I may come across. In the meantime, I look forward to seeing you working the big game next February. You're obviously far and away the cream of the crop...at least from WI, anyway.

You asked where a flag should be given. I told you (post 9). You stated they should be mandatory. I find that stupid. Am I not entitled to my opinion the same as you are entitled to yours? I think the US Flag Code is pretty compelling, personally. My personal opinion is that requiring a flag takes away all meaning of the flag -- I'll take that a step further -- requiring that ALL members of the crew (which you have to do if anyone wears the flag) wear one either means that all people really feel strongly over it (which is fine, and I would never tell you that you couldn't wear one), or some are simply wearing it to fit in, which I find a terrible reason to wear one.

My point, later, was this: On Internet boards it's polite to come in and get to know the people who have made this a community, not come in like a bull in a china shop and try to throw weight around. It's much more pleasant around here if you get to know us before calling us names.

And I don't consider myself anything special -- just another official running around the fields of southern Wisconsin Friday nights (and frequently other nights) in the fall with a few of my closest friends.

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by RichMSN

My personal opinion is that requiring a flag takes away all meaning of the flag -- I'll take that a step further -- requiring that ALL members of the crew (which you have to do if anyone wears the flag) wear one either means that all people really feel strongly over it (which is fine, and I would never tell you that you couldn't wear one), or some are simply wearing it to fit in, which I find a terrible reason to wear one.

Agree, completely. Unfortunately I work games in a state that thinks we can win the war on terror if only officials will wear the flag.

[ajmc]

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

Agree, completely. Unfortunately I work games in a state that thinks we can win the war on terror if only officials will wear the flag.

Can't say for sure about the officials in whatever State you work in, "Mr. Umpire", but your comments suggest there is at least one really smug, arrogant official in the mix who has no problem mocking all of his fellow officials and presumes to speak for an entire State.

Did your fellow officials actually tell you what they think, or is that just something someone so full of themself is automatically blessed with?

[MrUmpire]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Can't say for sure about the officials in whatever State you work in, "Mr. Umpire", but your comments suggest there is at least one really smug, arrogant official in the mix who has no problem mocking all of his fellow officials and presumes to speak for an entire State.

I would agree, and unfortunately he ruled that we all had to wear the flag.

[SethPDX]

Originally Posted by Ed Hickland

Personally, I think on the back is retreat position, I want Osama to see me charging directly at his sorry butt proudly displaying the American flag.

To me the back is a strange place to put it. Maybe the trend started in 2001 when the MLB teams did it. I can't recall teams putting flags there before then.

Originally Posted by MrUmpire

Agree, completely. Unfortunately I work games in a state that thinks we can win the war on terror if only officials will wear the flag.

Kind of how I feel about it. But if my boss tells me to wear this or that, then...

Incidentally, I haven't seen any flags on HS officials in OR.

[InsideTheStripe]

Originally Posted by ajmc

Can't say for sure about the officials in whatever State you work in, "Mr. Umpire", but your comments suggest there is at least one really smug, arrogant official in the mix who has no problem mocking all of his fellow officials and presumes to speak for an entire State.

Did your fellow officials actually tell you what they think, or is that just something someone so full of themself is automatically blessed with?

Seems as though you missed his point...

[Adam]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

Point is Rich, I came looking for advice. I got advice and then I also got what I consider more of a chastising because I was for the flags.

No, you got chastised for saying it should be mandatory. I'm all for the flags, in spite of the flag code. I also think if worn, they should be worn on the right sleeve per the flag code. But that's not how it's done here; and I'm in a military town. I think it should be optional, though.

[waltjp]

Originally Posted by Canned Heat

I like them, I think they're decent and professional looking, and add a little class, maybe even a bit of pride, respect, or authority to the uniform as a whole. Something that is seriously missing in society when you see all of the flack and incidents that are happening between refs/umps and fans, players and such.

Oddly, the US Flag Code states that it's disrespectful to place the flag on athletic uniforms.

Go figure.