Case Book Question

[Theisey]

After I got home and has some free time to review the changed IW section in rule 4, I thought it would to allow for PSK to apply in as in this play.

However, the more I read the section, the more I became convinced that PSK does not apply and therefore the penalty will probably be accepted by team-K and marked off from the previous spot.

Maybe their intent was to allow PSK, but I don't see that in the way the rule was rewritten. To bad as it would be have been a better solution to a bad situation.

[youngump]

Originally Posted by Theisey

After I got home and has some free time to review the changed IW section in rule 4, I thought it would to allow for PSK to apply in as in this play.

However, the more I read the section, the more I became convinced that PSK does not apply and therefore the penalty will probably be accepted by team-K and marked off from the previous spot.

Maybe their intent was to allow PSK, but I don't see that in the way the rule was rewritten. To bad as it would be have been a better solution to a bad situation.

So you'd give K a first down in the OP? (Plus 15 more when you kick out the R coach?)
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[mbyron]

Why wouldn't PSK apply? The foul occurred on R, after the kick, and before the kick ended.

[Theisey]

Well, who's in possession of the ball when the IW is blown. Where is that clearly defined? Is it really team-R or is it really still team-K.

I just looked into the 2008 "Redding" guide for NFHS football and a similar play says that team-R is not in possession at this time. Therefore if that is correct, and their play result says so, team-R is not in possession. That means PSK does not apply.

Don't kill the messenger here... I thought I new this area of the game cold but now I'm not so sure I do.

[mbyron]

Originally Posted by Theisey

Well, who's in possession of the ball when the IW is blown. Where is that clearly defined? Is it really team-R or is it really still team-K.

The IW with the (loose) ball rolling around makes the ball dead, which ends the kick, just as if the ball had come to rest on the ground. Why wouldn't R possess the ball? Doesn't it matter that the loose ball was kicked?

I'm not looking to kill a messenger, I just don't see the rationale for the message.

[Sonofanump]

I have always had a problem with this exact play. (in therory not ever on the field)

I think the rules provide for a previous spot enforcement.

Philosophically, it makes too much sense not to enforce it as PSK from the dead ball spot.

[Bob M.]

REPLY: This play has an asterisk in front of it, indicating that it is a change since last season. In last season's case book, the ruling was to penalize from the previous spot. Now in 2008, with a clarification to the PSK criteria, one that the Fed calls an editorial change, and a mostly insignificanrewording of the IW procedures, I can't understand what caused the change the the 4.2.3 ruling.

After all, as Tom pointed out, absent the foul, who would next be entitled to put the ball in play? It would be K because of the IW. If the Fed wants it different, they better find a way to get the rules to coincide with that desire.